Inside NBA All-Star Tech Summit

This transcript has been transcribed by Riverside.fm, no edits (please excuse any errors)

seancallanan (00:01.773)
I'm Sean Callanan and welcome to episode 409, 409 of Sports Geek. In this bonus episode, that's right, two episodes this week, I look back at the NBA All-Star Tech Summit I attended in San Francisco. And as the intro said there, I'm very grateful for all the people that helped and assisted in allowing me to be there. As always, you can contact me at Sean Callinan.

on most social media networks. Please look for SportsGeek on YouTube and on your podcast players and find all of our podcasts, whether it be this one, our main interview series, SportsGeek rapid rundown, our daily episode, looking at the world of sports business and getting you up to date on a daily basis, or our SportsGeek amplify series where we dive into the tech of sports and how it can help you. If you'd listen to 408, which was only released a day or so ago,

You would have learned and where I reviewed and pulled back the curtain on working at the Pro Bowl and Super Bowl. did that with my producer Dylan Parks. You'll know that I've been in the USA recently. It's well worth a listen, especially if you're in the execution mode, you're someone that creates content, manages channels, because we really dove deep on the why and sweating the copy and…

Sweating the formats and picking the right platforms and choosing the collaborators. So it's a very Very behind-the-scenes Look, I know people in the digital working digital teams will sort of listen to you with a nodding head But if you're someone that manages a team, it's a really good insight into hey, what is what is it like? What does it take to create great? content and great social media content

because that's what we really dove in on episode 408. So check that out. And so after the Super Bowl, since I was in the US and I looked at the calendar, I set my sights on San Francisco, primarily not for the All-Star weekend, although it's a lot of things happening that weekend, but more specifically the NBA All-Star Tech Summit. For those of you don't know, the NBA All-Star Tech Summit,

seancallanan (02:23.446)
Think started in the year 2000 and it's the NBA's way of bringing in all of their key partners from a broadcast and technology point of view and trying to figure out what's next. And I've always been someone that watched it from afar and seen a few people that I know, people that have either been on the podcast or vendors to the NBA posting about it and how great it was and really the networking opportunities there. So I just thought, well, I'm going to be in the States.

I'll see if I can come along. Little did I realize the task that I set myself that the NBA All-Star Tech Summit is the hardest, the hardest ticket to obtain in sports and entertainment in a little way. It's not a ticket that's for sale. You can't purchase a spot. It's completely invite only. And yeah, and I started to get this feedback from when I was reaching out to

to friends in the NBA, whether they be people that I've worked with or people who've been on the podcast, people I know via association with conferences like SEAT and NSF. And yeah, I got a lot of people saying, yeah, I'd love to go. I've been trying to go. I've worked in the NBA for 15 years. I've never got in. So that didn't deter me. I still locked in my tickets. I was still gonna be in San Francisco at that time.

I just continue, you know, one of the things that I really do appreciate from my network is the effort they put in. But I think that's also part of the work that I put into my network as well in reaching out to people, offering advice, connecting them with the right people. So I think I had a fair few credits in the Canva Bank, if you will. So I just kept asking. I just kept asking everyone I know how to write.

How do I get in? Who should I talk to? What's the way in? Do you have some sway? And luckily enough, those questions and that, I guess, that determinedness paid off. I'm lucky enough to catch up with my good friend, Lara Toscani-Weems from Elevate while I was in New Orleans. And she said she knew some of the people in the NBA PR team.

seancallanan (04:46.052)
And she would give me the right names to reach out when she did reach out. She found out what I'd already found out that it's that it was really hot ticket. It was really hard to get was well and truly over oversubscribed. But her advice was, hey, send through your details. Tell them what you do as far as sports geek as a podcast and the things you do in talking about sports technology and connecting people. And the fact I've had a few high profile NBA guests. So I did that.

And I got a reply. Yes, it's over subscribe. It's really hard to get in but we'll put you on the waitlist so I took that I took that small win as I was in New Orleans and then waiting to You know go to San Francisco the week after And so I got to New Orleans on the Thursday again specifically making sure I was going to be in there in San Francisco for this one day this this Friday

All-star tech summit. That's exactly, that was the only reason I was going to San Francisco. I'd come all that way. I was still on the wait list. I hadn't heard anything. So I thought, well, there's no point sitting in my hotel and wondering or waiting. I headed into the Hilton there in San Francisco and immediately sort of knew, I guess, buzz around the hotel.

So I was walking in there was some familiar faces some that I know personally and professionally like a view from from WSC who's been on the podcast and I was lucky enough to say thank you I really appreciate being able to use clip pro everything that we do with the with the NFL accounts But then there was also NBA owners walking in like the worries owner Joe Laker NBA legends like power cell Yao Ming are walking in and there was a lot of

a lot of activity in the lobby. potentially there were people in the lobby that weren't getting in. So eight o'clock passed, I knew it all kicked off at 8.30, so I went through security, went up to the registration desk, everyone was there, it was quite a packed room where everyone was trying to get their credentials to be able to get in. I went to the media desk and again introduced myself to Sean Callanan from Sportsgeek.

seancallanan (07:05.246)
got my name down the wait list. I was just wanting to check if there was a pass available. And unfortunately, at that time, they said, sorry, we're at capacity at the moment, but if you would like, you can hang around and see if someone doesn't show. And so that's pretty much what I did. I stayed in the registration area. There was some more familiar faces at registration. Jeff Smith, who's now at the…

Golden State Valkyries, who's been on the podcast, Bob Morgan, who's a long time member at Facebook. I saw him there. And then Kevin Cote, he used to work at the Warriors and then at Meta, and now he's at Google, so doing some interesting things. So I felt I was in a familiar place and I knew a few people in the room. Eventually, A30 came and went and the room started to thin out and…

Eventually, think Adam Silver went up to do the opening keynote, so the registration room was quite empty. I went back to the media desk and said, is there any more pastors available? I'm having to wait a little bit longer. And thankfully enough, said, I passed the handout of my business card and they came back and handed me one of these, a pass to get in.

I must say, I was absolutely elated. It was a bit of a pinch me moment. One, not knowing how hard it was to get in, but also seeing, you know, over 20 years of people that I know and respect talking about the tech summit and what was available. So when I finally got in there, it was a packed room, standing room only. The first panel was almost one of my favorite panels. was StreamTech, the next generation.

really looking at and again, it's always a debate with conferences. Should you be having the same conversation or the same panel title year on year? I think this is one that should be year on year all the time because the streaming tech and the next generation of fans and the next generation of viewers is always, it's always a pertinent issue. And so on that panel, it definitely had the breadth of

seancallanan (09:27.264)
of providers in that we had someone from YouTube, you had the chairman from ESPN, you had someone from Apple TV, you had Bella who was the Chief Content Officer for Netflix, you had someone from NBC. So was a really wide mix, very much for the US market, but the fact it shows, like it is globally, they were talking about the fractured nature of sport and sports rights and…

but also how they're going about chasing that younger fan. What does that younger fan want to watch? What kind of content do they want to watch? How do they bring that younger fan into the longer form game? Is that even possible? So one, I found that terribly interesting. think if I look at that initial panel and some of the key points out of it was

you know, those viewership challenges. Then there was also that piece of, I guess, broadcast TV renaissance, the fact that even though there's all these streaming pieces, those big moments where they'd be Super Bowl, Grand Finals in my part of the world, people are still drawn to broadcast TV and the big screen. There was a lot of conversation around how AI and personalizing

your content. So Jimmy Pitaro at ESPN talked about the concept of My ESPN in that you'll open up the app and it will just be all catered to you. But one of the things that I did, you know, when I look at that panel and I really hope to, you know, I saw I met with Bella from Netflix after the event, after the panel, they were all talking about technology and what could be done in formats. And one of the things that should,

that she said was storytelling and making people feel something that never goes away. And that's been Netflix's strength in its documentary series like Drive to Survive and sort of been their first foray into the sports. I completely agree with that. People will tune in for that storytelling element and that story they want to cheer on. So we've seen a lot of

seancallanan (11:55.259)
people tuning into the WNBA through Caitlin Clark. We've seen a lot of people tune into the NFL through the storytelling around Taylor Swift and her interaction with the NFL. So I think there was a lot in that. The other takeaway I got from that one was also, I just guess the growth of YouTube as a destination, but then also sort of the…

And saw the piece that the creator economy and, you know, thankfully I've got a really good podcast coming up with the CEO of Dude Perfect. But the fact that the creators from a YouTube point of view are really moving the needle and they're not just, you know, influencers per se. And we even saw that come to fruition with Mr. Beast, you know, appearing on All-Star Sunday and effectively doing a segment, doing a video in there. So.

and credit to Credit to the CEO of YouTube. He said he was talking about creators and YouTube creators eight years ago at the tech summit So at some point You always you are going to be right you keep throwing out Predictions, but yeah, I think Yeah, that was one of the you know, that was the first session that was definitely the session one of my highlight sessions for for the tech summit the second session

was a bit more of a deeper dive with Nvidia's Jensen Huang, sort of talking about AI, I guess the growth of AI, where it can be applied both in business, but also in sport. And also, he even discussed, because it only came out a couple of weeks earlier, the concept of deep link and the new Chinese

AI that doesn't require a high chip and CPU processing. And rather than seeing it as a threat and, you know, it did affect the share price for Nvidia pretty quickly, he saw it as, again, another opportunity for another leap and another leap forward for AI. There were some really good points in his discussion in sort of looking at how

seancallanan (14:21.67)
AI will be integrated into coaching and sort of analysis and video analysis of players. And then he sort of discussed the sort of broader pieces of, I guess, not being scared of AI. It's more how you go about using it. And the way he sort of described it was the way that you ask AI to do something for you is the same as how

a leader should be asking and inspiring people to do things for them. And so he talked about his use cases of getting a huge white paper and 70 pages and not reading it, but rather loading it into an AI model, whether it be Claude or ChatGPT, and then just having a conversation about the document rather than using it. So…

it was interesting to hear him how he, sort of goes about using it. I mean, the main thing that I took away, it's something that I've strongly believed in sort of, leveraging AI and seeing what it can offer. it was, you know, somebody who uses AI can outperform someone who doesn't use AI. And that's as simple as it gets. and so I think from my point of view, if you haven't got a

a strategy around one, how you want to use AI. And there's, I guess, two parts of it, whether it's that external data, everything that's outside of your business. How do you cut through the fog and how do you cut through all the noise and how do you cut through all that information to synthesize it to something being useful? That one is easier to execute and less risky. the second one is what does that look like for your internal data? But then also, if you're looking at your internal data,

How do you make sure that that internal data remains internal data? So they're the two things that I think are the starting points for what an AI strategy looks like. Be more than happy to discuss what we've been doing in the AI space in developing sports geek reads and the sports geek rapid rundown. I think there's a real opportunity for sports to take on board

seancallanan (16:48.7)
these assets and I guess these technologies, because I think what they do do is, as Jensen said, allow you to outperform what you should perform if you're just doing it by yourself. And so what can you get with that incremental gain is really important. Then the second panel of the day was more looking at

investment strategies and following the money and and the investment strategies around sports sports tech and some of it was more around The fact that the leagues and the and the teams are growing in value because they are premium There is real scarcity. There's There's only 30 NBA teams There's no more. You can't just go and buy one off the shelf that has helped lift the lift the value

But then also looking at things like the intellectual property of a league and a team and a player, it was their opinion that was largely undervalued. And then I think the other piece was the stuff around how they could use AI and data analysis of the data. Like there's a lot of…

data around player wellness and health, how that is being, I guess, leveraged and made sure that, you know, NBA players, but then all athletes can best perform. Those enhancements, whether they be across sleep, you know, recovery, rehab, those kinds of things.

I think that will be some of the key things that will continue to be discussed at the NBA Tech Summit, but also will be a key point of where that money does flow. And then what we will see is the advances that we do see at the high level, we will start seeing them flow through to more of a consumer type product, whether that be…

seancallanan (19:11.204)
advances in Fitbits and Apple Watches and Apple Health and those kind of things. So currently, the things that say LeBron James, who's reportedly spending $1 million a year on his body to continue to do the freakish things that he does at 40 years old, that price, thanks to AI and…

I guess machine learning and access to more CPUs, that price will come down and that will be more accessible by more people. So it's gonna be interesting to see how that develops. The other piece of that investment strategy, especially for those investing in leagues, whether they be established leagues like the NBA or new leagues that we're seeing pop up, whether they be new football leagues,

new basketball leagues, new leagues around new sports like pickleball and the like, is trying to analyze the data for that predictor of fandom. And so a lot of the data that we have seen in the past, getting a kid playing sport before the age of 10, one of the ones that was mentioned at the conference was the best predictor of fandom is a kid going to a game before they turn 14.

So how do they make sure that those kids that are currently consuming content, they might be doing it through YouTube creators, that that might be their entry point into the NBA when it was previously, it might've been an NBA countdown or a Saturday morning show, like that has shifted. But then also, how do you make the game accessible so they can come to a game to lock in their fandom? So that was some of the things that, you know, it was a pretty broad discussion.

around the investments piece, but I think there's more available. And then the third panel was very much future-focused. Tell us about tomorrow, understanding the complex forces and shaping the future. And so this one did get really geeky really quickly, but in talking about, you know,

seancallanan (21:38.179)
how AI could be used. one of the things that I found fascinating, and I think it was, I'm just trying remember who, the name of the panelist, if I quickly jump here, I can find it. think it was Kevin, Kevin Weill from OpenAI. He talked about…

Using ai and how much ai is disrupting computer programming Okay, so that's an industry I used to be in I was 15 years a computer programmer And literally two months ago I have not coded in 15 years while i've been doing sports geek. I don't count cutting and pasting html as coding But I just went to claude and said hey i'm going to start coding again, you're going to help me do it

And that's how we built SportsGeek Reads. So if you go to [reads.sportsgeekhq.com](http://reads.sportsgeekhq.com/), that's a fully-fledged Reddit-looking curated site of sports business links that are pulled in every day. I would not have been able to build that six months ago because my coding skills are too rusty and the language that I learned is no longer relevant.

But yeah, so one of the stats was ChatGPT currently is in the top, I'd have to look at the, I think he was saying the top 175 programmers in the world, but in the next few developments, it'll be in the top 1 % of the world. So again, going back to Jensen's,

quotes around Nvidia like you've got to start talking to the to these AI operators that are computer programmers like they're Like currently they're junior programmers But in the very in a few months time, they will be senior programmers. They will be able to build things and it'll all come down to the people who can Provide the specs who can be really clear on what they want

seancallanan (23:59.394)
and be really clear on what they don't want and have a real test mindset to be able to spot where there are errors because junior programmers make errors and so junior AI programmers will also make errors. So making sure that you've got people that can think in what are the requirements, what are the outputs, what are the things that we want. Because now you've got

you know, talented, ready to go program is at your disposal. You're still going to obviously need a project manager or someone that can specify the requirements and potentially someone that might specify what the testing that you want around it. But the ability to go from, I like that idea, I want to build it. Used to be, I've got to write it down, I've got to tell a developer something, that developer's got to come back.

And in my 15 years, I've seen many sports industry folk, unfortunately, get fleeced by either shonky developers, which is one of reasons I started Sportsgeek, or just developers that aren't very good. Because developers aren't very good. Guess what? They take ages. They cost a lot. And they don't deliver what you actually ask for. And so what these…

AI operators now can give you is the ability to vastly iterate, get a minimum viable product up and actually test, hey, does this idea work? Can we get it right? And then you can go to someone with more structure, but you've actually got an 85 % delivered product by there. So then some of the other stuff, there was a little bit of overlap around the…

using AI to predict risks for athletes, such as ACL tears and bone issues and provide personalized training and nutrition. I think that one's got a little bit more ways to go because I think it will be the case of trying to convince, you know, the sports physiologists and all of the physical therapists that, hey, they know their way. Are they ready to be disrupted?

seancallanan (26:28.32)
There's already a conversation both in the NBA and many sports around load management. Will coaches and players take advice from an AI that says you need to train less? But I think there was discussion also around how to use generative AI to improve the fan experience, back to that point around personalizing the fan experience.

How can you, whether that be with a chatbot, with something that's conversational or even voice now, how can you use that to improve the fan experience? Again, that's gonna be one that I totally expect to become more more common. But again, it will come down to how do you test that experience? How do you make sure that it doesn't feel like there's a robot at the end of that?

end of that conversation. So yeah, so I enjoyed that one. I enjoyed the geeking out, but also just that insight of how disruptive AI is going to be to computer programmers. But computer programming has been disrupted and it disrupted itself for many, years, whether it be…

changes in architecture and changes in code and changes in code styles and platforms. The smart people and the smart people in the computer programming space will be the ones that will be able to marshal a team of AI developers. And so that will be the key thing from a computer programming point of view. But from a sports point of view, there's some real

really exciting options to be able to produce more and test, to use Mark Zuckerberg's phrase, move fast and break things. You'll be able to move fast and break things really quickly. And then once you do realize what works and what doesn't work, that's when you can move forward with those pieces. I think there will be a lot of work done in plugging the gaps.

seancallanan (28:49.767)
and plugging the issues in integration that we see a lot in sports. Data comes in here and needs to get over there, but there's not a custom connector. We can't quite get that work to work. I think that's where there's a lot of opportunity to go, well, actually I can get that to work. I just need to tell my AI developer, this is my inputs, this is where I want to go, this is where I want to end up, this is how often it comes through, this is how it gets triggered. How do I get that to there?

rather than it being stuck in, I guess, no man's land in a manual process or worse, a never gets integrated process. So, yeah, I think that's gonna be a real interesting space. It's obviously something that we're leaning into at SportsGeek, sort of using all the different products and seeing which one works well for us. Then the other, one of the other sessions, which was, again, I did really like the streaming session at the start, but…

I did really enjoy the conversation with between Bob Costas and Steve Kerr Warriors Championship coach. I've just recently finished Steve Kerr's book. I really respect him as as a both a player and a coach. And so he sort of, you know, he discussed both the philosophy on coaching and ends.

importance of perspective and team culture. And he really lent into what, you know, his coach Greg Popovich at the Spurs would bring in world, perspectives into daily rituals and, and to, to keep perspective to, to, you know, elite athletes, you can get separated from the, from the real world. So he sort of took a lot of that from Pop. And then he did discuss

You know, the evolution of the NBA and the fact that they may have started it, but everyone's now shooting threes all the time. His summation of that is, well, you can complain about it, but you've got to keep shooting threes to stay in the game. There were some really interesting pieces also, and he's got some really good perspective because he'd spent time in…

seancallanan (31:15.457)
in different parts of the world growing up. But sort of looking at the European players and the American players, he was of the opinion, and I tend to agree, that the European players have the advantage of playing multiple sports as they grow up. They're not just playing basketball, they're playing soccer, or they're doing track, or they're playing other sports. It gives them a little bit more of a rounded, I guess, perspective.

I guess just a different way to tackle the game. So yeah, I'm an unabashed Steve Kerr fan. There was actually even a joke there where they were talking about Steve Kerr's famed Michael Jordan practice where he got punched in the face by Michael Jordan for sort of vectly standing up to him and playing some defense. And then he joked, just imagine if that happened in the NBA today.

And then he went, hang on, scratch that. It's a much laughter, obviously referring to the Draymond Green, Jordan Poole punching incident just a couple of seasons ago. So ability to laugh at things and keep things light. yeah, like I said, really appreciated Steve Kerr's insight from that chat with Bob Costas. And then the last session, which is really good one to sort of wrap a bow in the

in the conference was all about leadership. And it was led by TNT's Ernie Johnson and sort of looking at the different panelists. And we had Sabrina Inescu and Jaylen Bronson and Victor Wembanyama, as well as some military leaders. I'll get the military. We had Michael Rubin from Fanatics.

and General Martin Dempsey from the US Army. So it was a real diverse leadership group and sort of talking about what leadership means to them, how it's changing, the focus on continuous improvement.

seancallanan (33:32.572)
So yeah, so I think there was a lot in that in both getting it from a US decorated general to someone like Jalen Brunson, who's leading the New York Knicks to a 21 year old, Victor Womanyama, who even though he's in his second season, he's displaying leadership qualities. Ernie did ask him, how does he be a leader when you've got…

one of the greatest coaches of all time, Gregg Popovich, and then Chris Paul, who's almost twice his age and a long time NBA veteran and leader. And Victor's response was, I guess, paying homage to both of those, the fact that both coach Pop and Chris Paul were allowing Victor to lead, but he was always a sponge in learning more.

I'm learning more from all of those players. And yeah, it was a good way to wrap up the Tech Summit. Now that's just all the content, right? And so I got a lot from the content every time the session happened, Ammar Brashaw would come out and say, hey, we're just going to have a quick break. We'll be back in 10 minutes. And it was so like…

Again, I now know why it's such a hot ticket. was, you the networking was, you know, phenomenal. So again, lucky enough to see Jay Riola from the Orlando Magic who was in the, who was there and has been on the podcast. It was great to catch up with Jay. Good to catch up with a few other people, but one of the person, one person that really impressed me and I still hold hope that I will get him on the.

Get him on the podcast that I went up and introduced myself to Alexis Ohanian. If you don't know Alexis is, he's the former, oh, he's the founder of Reddit. And now, if I get it right, he's now running, Ohanian, I should say, not Hanlon. He's now running 776, I think it's called.

seancallanan (35:57.691)
which is an investment firm, but primarily looking at sports investments and primarily women's sports investments. So, you know, I'd love to have a chat to him, know, Angel City FC is one of his investments and a few others that he's making in the space. Unfortunately, like after a quick chat, said, unfortunately, I normally pass on most podcasts opportunities because of

Sometimes gets him in trouble with the share price and things like that if he says the wrong thing on a podcast But what impressed me most I handed out my business card and Alexa said thank you and he scanned it quickly and got my contact details. He said look I'm gonna connect you with My PR folk I'm gonna decline but I really do appreciate it and then he actually said do you use Riverside? And I said I do I'm recording this episode right now on Riverside FM He said thank you. He was an early investor, but the

So absolutely, in Australia I would say, he's absolutely top-loke. But what blew me away was as as we parted, literally 90 seconds later, I got an email. Hey, I've already warned Sean that we probably can't do the podcast, but I'm connecting you. Sean, thanks for using the Riverside, I really appreciate it. And he'd sent that in the 10 seconds he'd walked away. And that, it reminded me of Mark Cuban,

who again sort of just stays at the top of his inbox and his inbox is heroes because he just sees something, just deals with it, delegates it and done. And it's something that I want to aspire to, like not sitting on something or I'll reply to that later. Like that discipline to do that straight away, get it off his plate, it's now off his plate. Now it's up to me to go back and…

and reach out and potentially interview him down the track, but most likely I'll just interview all of the great investments and teams that he's interviewed, sorry, he's invested in. So that was one of my highlights. Overall, then also seeing all those Boston Dynamic robots, which I did see, know, Adam Silver and the Warriors present at the start, I'll put the YouTube click.

seancallanan (38:24.299)
a clip in the show notes for this. It was bit of tongue in cheek in talking about how robots could be used in an NBA sense, but seeing those Boston Dynamic robots in person was a little bit scary. It was a little bit Terminator-like, but $150,000 they go for and they'll do circuits of your factory and check things are safe and those kind of things. So I can see their purpose.

Yeah, I think it'll be a little bit longer till we start seeing them at sports events But you never know you never know. So that's pretty much my wrap up of the NBA All-Star Tech Summit, guess my only other note is a shout out and a thank you to Kenny Lauer a good friend of mine who used to run the marketing at the Warriors To invite me along to Steph Curry's All-Star Game Brunch So I went there

on the Sunday, did not expect to turn around and see Steph Curry just having some eggs for the morning. But it was great to catch up with Kenny and sort of be part of that All-Star weekend buzz. Also great to see Daniel Brutaleschi in the back of the room there at the All-Star Summit. I know it was a busy weekend for him hosting everyone at the Chase Center.

which did an amazing job and congrats to you, Brew. Really great to see the success that you're having. And then, yeah, again, as I sort of said at the top, I'm just super grateful that the amount of people that I've connected with, interviewed, helped, I guess I think they all pulled in the right direction to get me to the All-Star Summit. I hope to go again.

I don't attempt fate and think hey, I can go every year but The reason I'm doing this podcast is I've you know, found a terrific value. I think the NBA is doing some great things in the space And you know, I'm an NBA fan at heart and I really do appreciate some of the stuff they do in the in the technology space It definitely makes the game more accessible Globally and definitely my part of the world the NBA is well entrenched here in the here in Australia with a

seancallanan (40:48.556)
with a lot of fans. So that's it for this episode, this double episode, two for the week, recapping. So episode 408 was recapping all things NFL and Super Bowl and Pro Bowl games and how we went about it. And I did that with my digital producer, Dylan Parks. And then this one, recapping all things NBA All-Star Week, it's primarily the Tech Summit. I really do appreciate the support.

From everyone who listens, I really do appreciate the people that reached out while I was in the States, some that I was able to connect with and some that I was not able to connect with due to the manic nature of those three weeks. But I really do appreciate both your listenership and your attention and your support. But until next episode, my name is Sean Callanan and you've been listening to Sports Geek.