Why Investment Metrics Don’t Work in Sports – Romie Chaudhari, Chiron Investments

This transcript has been transcribed by Riverside.fm, no edits (please excuse any errors)

Sean Callanan (00:01.346)

Very happy to welcome Romie Chaudhari. He's the CEO and managing principal for Chiron Investments. Romie, welcome to the podcast.

Romie Chaudhari (00:08.743)

Thanks for having me. Happy to be here.

Sean Callanan (00:12.948)

Not a problem at all. I always start trying to figure out how people got in the world of sports business. You've got a long career in sports investment, but what was your first foray into the world of sports business?

Romie Chaudhari (00:25.2)

The first deal I actually had an opportunity to be a part of was actually a deal that never came to fruition. I was asked to be part of a group to buy the Atlanta Hawks back in like 2013 or so and spent a year doing due diligence on the deal. We finished second in the bidding and

Sean Callanan (00:41.036)

Okay.

Romie Chaudhari (00:53.996)

ended up not winning the deal. And I thought that was my one opportunity. It's not a world I come from. I was an engineer by trade and a real estate investor and very much under the radar. And I never even was in my spectrum of possibility to have a chance to be part of owning a professional sports franchise.

Sean Callanan (01:05.186)

Mm-hmm.

Romie Chaudhari (01:20.196)

and so what the Atlanta Hawks deal didn't have, when it first happened, I was like so surprised and I felt so lucky and, to be part of a group like that. And, and then when it didn't happen, I was like, well, at least maybe I made some friends. remember sending a message to some of the people in the group and saying, Hey, you know what? even though this didn't happen, at least I can call you guys my friends. And, you know, at least that's for me as a silver lining out of all of this. And.

I remember still a couple of the principals of our group coming to me and telling me this, you know what, Romie, you don't realize this yet, but you've got five or six of these in you. You just don't know it yet. And I'm like, yeah, okay, you know, whatever. within a couple of months after that, I was asked about English football. And what do know about English football? And at the time I said, I know absolutely nothing.

Sean Callanan (01:59.854)

Yep.

Romie Chaudhari (02:16.27)

And they said, well, you want to buy a team with us? We don't know either, but we're going to do some homework. And I said, well, if I can understand the economics behind it, then I would be totally open to exploring it. And that was my first real deal. That was it. closed in 2016, but we started the due diligence on it back in 2014. And that was my very first experience into sports team ownership. One is evaluating the deal, but not it not happening.

And the second one was the one that actually happened.

Sean Callanan (02:51.726)

So that deal you're talking about with Swanson City Football Club, English Premier League. And so again, so if that was your first foray into the world of sport, what skill set and what was your previous experience to be able to look at sport as a business coming up from that lens?

Romie Chaudhari (02:53.848)

Yes.

Romie Chaudhari (03:09.269)

Very good question. And to be honest, the metrics that I use historically for any other type of investment do not work for professional sports, especially for English football. If you don't have what I learned. And so for me, what I learned in that deal was if you're not one of the big six teams, meaning Man U, Man City, Arsenal,

Liverpool, Chelsea, Tottenham, right? If you're not one of those six, it is high stakes gambling. There's always a risk of relegation. So that was my metric. Do I want to take a gamble on this or not? Because if I use any other analytical method, like, you know, I'm a real estate guy. If I start using similar types of metrics and mindset and how I how much risk I want to take and understanding what those risks are.

You would never make the investment in English football. Like at that time, I was like, there's no way I would do it. So I just kind of said, I'm going to step out and do it. I was asked to be a director as well for the club. And at the time I didn't realize it's a coveted position to have. And that that actually was a springboard and opened the door for all the other opportunities I've been offered since then. So that's the silver lining in all of it. But

in all honesty, the metrics that I typically use, would not use. I did not use for Swansea. And I was very, to be honest, to be totally honest, like I was not nearly as well informed as I am today. And so, you know, in terms of what I would be looking for to invest, if I were to do a sports team investment, it's it's changed. It's it's been fleshed out a lot more and more clearly defined.

there's always still risk more than some other deals that I typically do. But I do enjoy it. I did not get into sports because I enjoy sports. That was not the reason. I do enjoy sports, but I actually did it more for financial reasons and for diversification and things like that. And it has actually served me well.

Sean Callanan (05:34.688)

And I mean, we've seen a lot of, you know, an explosion, if you will, of private investment and equity into the world of sports. And some of them, you know, for varying reasons, some of them just want the, want the trophy or the court side seats and the, and the status that comes with it. You're obviously looking at with that business lens, but both having to figure out their business and then trying to figure out, like, as some sports teams, you know, even to now haven't really thought about what are the returns to, to, to the investors. They've always

you know, managed and worried about what's on the picture, what's on the court and sort of, you know, as long as we keep going to next season, we're fine. How has it been getting on the inside, but then trying to help them unlearn and saying, well, this is what a proper business, if I use that as a term, would operate and try to make a profit. How's it been trying to turn that ship around in some of your sports assets?

Romie Chaudhari (06:30.09)

Well, know, the partners, so, know, in Metwell, with Melbourne specifically, I pretty much have been driving the ship myself throughout. And in the other deals we've had, we've had partners, but they all shared that same thesis of running things like a proper business. When you start to bring limited partners in or other partners who have don't have experience in that, yes.

You do contend with with some of that because some people do they they're they're literally their fortunes in their minds change with each game. Right. As the win lose, don't play well. I tell people, hey, listen, don't let it ruin your day. Like there's always going to be another game another day. mean, look, English football is different. If you get relegated, it's really bad. I lived through that. So I know what it is like. And yes.

Sean Callanan (07:11.518)

Mm. Yep.

Romie Chaudhari (07:29.225)

It can get very emotional and I get very emotional and I did in the very beginning and you've learned like I've learned now. You don't get too high. You don't get too low. One thing I don't interfere in is like the on court stuff in basketball or soccer or anything else. I really don't. What I try to do is provide all the support possible so that we can get a good product on the court and we can hopefully get a good result.

but you just do the best to surround the players and coaching staff with everything that they need. And then you live with the results. you can't get too high or too low. And that's the one thing I encourage the people, even our staff, I love that they care so much, but I tell them, I'm like, look, if we didn't play well, it doesn't mean that our season's over. We're not gonna stink the rest of the year. Like there's gonna be ups and downs and let's just ride it out. And I think that's the one thing I've learned.

But I've always been that way. think from day one, I tried not to get the results, let the results to get to me.

Sean Callanan (08:33.006)

So you mentioned there another asset in my part of the world, Southeast Melbourne, Phoenix playing in the NBL. How did you come up? How did you come up? You're in Miami, you're in English football and then basketball in Australia. You sort of said, how did that opportunity come to you? Like, is it something you were looking for? Was it something that was, know, outreach happening? Like, how did that opportunity come to you to get on your radar?

Romie Chaudhari (09:00.873)

Yeah, it's a pretty, pretty interesting story. I actually was a part owner of the New Zealand Breakers that I was supporting a friend of mine. So the managing partner at the time was a guy named Matt Walsh who owned New Zealand. And he asked me, would I be willing to be a board member and make a small investment in the team? And he said he wanted someone with English football directorship experience. It would be good for a cache for the for the club.

Sean Callanan (09:09.123)

Okay, yep.

Sean Callanan (09:14.872)

Mm-hmm.

Romie Chaudhari (09:30.856)

And he wanted me to provide some input and stuff like that. So I said yes. And I really, you know, that was just trying to support him, you know, at the time. Within a few months, I actually got approached by the NBL and they said, well, would you be interested in having your own team? And I said, no. Originally I said, no, I'm not interested.

It's on the other side of the world. I don't know anything about it. I'm tired of, I got enough stuff going. I closed on, you know, I was in the middle of working through the D.C. United deal also with my partners. OK, so that was also happening at the same time. So I said, no, I don't think I want to do this. I remember Matt came to me and said, are you sure you don't want to do this? Like you you really should take a look at this. And I looked at it and I said, OK, you know what?

Yeah, I believe that this league is going to grow. think it's got a lot of potential. You know, I didn't understand the structure or the revenue sharing and all that at the time. I didn't do that much homework until I got closer to doing the deal. But I remember saying, was like, you know what, if I can, it has to be Melbourne or Sydney. And I've got to be able to see where my guys are going to play, where they're going to practice, where they're going to get physio.

where they're gonna eat, where my front office is gonna be, right? So all the infrastructure has to be there and all I have to do is hire people and sign players. If that's a possibility, then I'm interested. And then we said, that's possible. So they said, you tell us where you wanna be. And I said, well, they said, if you pick Melbourne, the government is gonna back you.

with the state basketball, which was today now the state basketball center. And I still remember asking. And so that's how it started. And that's what happened is that I ended up doing that deal and even closing that deal. And it was a very interesting story. I don't want to go off topic, but it was very interesting how that deal was put together. And the days after I closed the conversations I had with.

Romie Chaudhari (11:55.034)

Hawthorne and all this stuff. It was kind of funny because I didn't know anything about Melbourne at the time. But I do want the one thing I do remember saying is culture, culture, culture. And what are we about? We want to connect with the community. That is what we've been focusing on throughout. But but that's how the opportunity in Melbourne came about.

Sean Callanan (12:15.254)

And then like you sort of said, like you're not living in Melbourne, you're not flying to Melbourne, you're not checking out, you're not looking over people's shoulders all the time. How is important is that, you know, getting some of those highs right and setting that culture, you know, when you are a long, long, long, long way away, but to say, Hey, here's what, here's what we want to work, work towards, you know, in the, in the NBL, which is a growing, growing lead with growing audiences, growing attendance, you know, big numbers that are happening on TV. It's, you know, it's heading in the right direction for what you want to do.

Romie Chaudhari (12:20.962)

No.

Romie Chaudhari (12:44.473)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I mean, yes, it was looking back like I took a lot of risk. Maybe I didn't realize in time how much risk I was taking. But I remember, you know, when the when the league told me, hey, we could do all this stuff for you and there's going to be a state basketball center. And I couldn't get any of that in writing, by the way. None of it was in writing because it was going to be based on who won the elections. Right. At that time. So the incumbent.

Sean Callanan (13:10.136)

Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (13:14.276)

was loving sport and they said, well, think coming wins are going to back you if the other side. So what happens the other side was, they well, we'll work on it and we believe we'll be to get that to happen. So I said, OK, well, can I get it right? They said, no. I said, OK, well, what's what's the election? What's what's the race looking like? Is it like that even once and what they said is that even? So I'm just like, well, all right, you know what? And I also said, hey, you know,

revenue share agreement is an ideal for the league. I said, you know what, I'm gonna go ahead and roll the dice. The league is in its infancy. Let's see how it goes. And then yes, the next move was finding people. And you know, my eventual CEO had no, no managerial experience. You know, he was a commentator, but he was very polished, and very authentic. And I got along with him great. But

He was literally giving me a tour of the stadium when I offered him the job. And it was not to be CEO. It was to be a GM. And then we could, you know, we could. And then from there, we did our hires after that. And and some we got right. Some we got wrong. But, you know, one thing we focused on was from day one. I said we made a mistake. I had told him that Tommy and I've told everyone I even told the first reporter I spoke to there that.

I don't want to make the mistakes that we made in Swansea. And one of the mistakes we made was we did not connect with the community. Right. And that was the prime, prime focus. You can ask Tommy, ask anybody. said, my job is to help facilitate in building something that the city can get behind of and be proud of and enjoy. I'm just a facilitator and I want to help build it.

But that's what it's about. And I said, in order to do that, one of the things we have to do is really connect with the community. I have to understand the customs that are there. I have to fit in. It's not anyone fitting in with me. I'm the outsider. I have to fit in. And so that is what I really focused on literally from day one.

Sean Callanan (15:32.16)

And now that you've got or, you know, either having assets in different parts of the world, there some things that are similar? Like even though there might be differences in how governments operate and how deals happen and compared to, you know, in Australia versus the DC United, DC United, you mentioned there in the MLS, is there some similarities in what you try to do or at least across all of your different properties?

Romie Chaudhari (15:58.149)

Yeah, I mean, look, administratively, it's like any other business. So as you start to aggregate some of these things, you can start doing a lot of shared services. I'm sure a lot of other owners do this sort of thing where they have shared services model and they outsource a lot of things to one place and helps cut costs and all those things. Yeah, I'm trying to think if there's anything specific that. You know, one league versus.

Sean Callanan (16:25.43)

Is it that community piece? Like you sort of said, it was a learning from Swansea and something from Phoenix. You sort of say, well, DC United, we have to make sure we get the community piece right because without fans, you're not a sports team. Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (16:27.476)

Yes.

Romie Chaudhari (16:32.818)

Yes. That is correct. So we do. So you're correct. Yeah. So so on the community side, that is something we've really focused on. I think I think the other thing is with as an organization, establishing a culture is so important. Right. So so you know, I want everybody to be there because they want to be there, not because they're getting a chat.

Right. I really want people to be happy there. I at least from a moral compass perspective, I want everyone to share a similar moral compass. Right. So how we execute things might be different and all that. But I want us all to morally, A, to be happy to be there, to want to be there because they like being there and B, to have a similar moral compass. And that's the foundation for building the culture that we have. We really wanted it to feel like a family for everybody. That's what we really tried to do.

And I think we try to do that across all the assets. Now, it's the one thing we've learned. It's easier said than done. And it's a whole lot easier to start that from day one, rather than having something this, you know, big thing and then trying to fix everything after much harder to do. It's much easier to start from day one. And so from day one, that is what we established. And I'm happy we did it that way, because I have seen now and not just in sports, but in other businesses.

where cultural issues, if they're not addressed early, they become a problem later on. And it is very hard to fix.

Sean Callanan (18:12.942)

And then absolutely. I mean, you sort of spoke about before about the ups and downs of being part of sport. You you get the elation and the craziness of a last second heave that goes in and you are part of the team, but it's also a business. what are a lot of metrics in sports are titles. How many trophies have you got? But what are some of the non-winning, non-on-court or on-court on-pitch success metrics that you're looking for in your

in your sports assets.

Romie Chaudhari (18:43.591)

Yeah, I mean, look, at the end of the day, it's a business, right? And there, you know, it's all tied to finances and profitability and all that. you know, the one thing we try to do and listen, if you if if you build your business from the ground up and you you focus on community and membership, youth participation and all of these things that will then feed into

valuations and revenue increases and valuation increases and all those things that come in that we're looking for on our financial statements. It all starts from the ground level and building off of that. Yeah. And then look, at the end of the day, we're trying to grow revenue growth year over year. That's what we're shooting for at all, you know, at all times. But doing so in a fiscally responsible way so that eventually you also

You don't want to have a cost problem at the expense of building revenue. So you want to make sure the costs are always manageable, managed, well managed, and that eventually you get to start to to see. Break even and then profitability, so you want to constantly build towards that. That's that's the mandate. That's where we're trying to go. We see a clear path to getting there. I think all the clubs in the league are striving towards that.

But again, from us, it starts from the day one cultural establishment that we've built and building that grassroots support. we, you know, our team is based, you know, as you all know, it's the heartland of Australian basketball, right? We've got a lot of untapped territory right there. So what we were striving for culturally fits well.

in the region that we're located in. so now, given that we've built the foundational pieces of an operating business, and they're very firmly established, now we can start turning those stones over. And that's where we're at right now, which is a very interesting time for us.

Sean Callanan (20:57.644)

And is that, mean, that must be an exciting time to, guess, I guess, give that momentum to your to your staff, but say, hey, come come back to us with ideas on, you know, how you can commercialize is how you can better serve that those those fans and then how we can bring partners on board and they sort of have that, I guess, bottom line mentality to say, if I, you if I pitch a project, I've got to be able to say what it's going to cost, but also what it's going to bring in.

And is that sort of that like we were sort of talking about earlier, that rewiring of the sports brain that sometimes is just focused on the product on the court.

Romie Chaudhari (21:28.996)

Yes.

Yes, that's correct. So we are not hobbyists. This is not a hobby. this is, know, the emotional attachment. Yes, there's some, but at the end of the day, this is a business and I make it crystal clear that, yes, we want to enjoy the journey, enjoy the ride, enjoy the sport, but, but it is, it is a business at the end of the day.

Sean Callanan (21:56.022)

And then you get to take advantage of whether it's things that the league is doing and that uplift or like in the case of, you know, MLS, you know, a guy like Messi plays for the other team. And it's like, well, how do we take advantage when he comes to town? Because we know our stadium will be packed and, and how will the ticket packages all get wrapped around that piece? I was lucky enough to be at DC United for the All-Star game a couple of years ago. like, you know, bringing in all those, bringing in all those fans that might be there for the first time to get them to come back.

Romie Chaudhari (22:08.653)

Yes.

Romie Chaudhari (22:23.564)

Yes. Yes, you want to try to get new fans and always we're trying to get new fans. And that's exactly what we do in Melbourne. And now, again, given that now we've we've really focused on building a very strong culture. We've accomplished that. Now it's about getting some of that grassroots support.

locally and getting new fans engaged. We've had, can't tell you how many times I've gone to games when I, when I do go there and how many people who are not basketball fans made the track. Either I invited them or friends of mine invited them or friends of theirs invited them or, and they come and they say, you know what? I've never been to a basketball game before. I had so much fun.

And I am coming back. Like, I love hearing that. We've actually had a lot of that, you know, a lot of them end up being like, you know, it's it's oftentimes it's corporates. It's it's non corporates. You know, I play a lot of, you know, I start playing a lot of tennis. So when I go to Melbourne, I play in tennis Australia. The guys I get with I think some of them never got a chance to go. like, why don't you come bring your partner with you, whatever you want. And I just I welcome anybody and everybody to come.

And I think we do a very good job of entertaining fans. And so I love seeing people come and then saying, can I come again? I'd like to come again. I really like that.

Sean Callanan (23:57.006)

So you've had some investments in really established sports and established teams in football and in basketball, but then you're also looking at what are effectively new sports in pickleball. How do you make an assessment on that? being an owner of the Miami Pickleball Club, it's obviously exploding from a participation point of view, but there's still the, what's it going to be from a fan?

Romie Chaudhari (24:24.373)

Yes.

Sean Callanan (24:24.575)

a fan and a consumer product. do you sort of tackle that as like there's no rule book for Pickleball.

Romie Chaudhari (24:29.952)

that that is correct. And you you hit the nail on the head. It's like, OK, you're having, you know, people hit like what's look like looks like a wiffle ball and they're just smacking the ball like, it great for TV? Right. because the holy grail is media rights. get media rights, pay media rights. That's what you know, that's what comes what comes with it then is increased valuations and whatnot. And so, you know, look, the one one thing I learned in investing in sports is

And why I did the NBL at the time is you're invested. Like I thought the league, you know, the league is professionally run or set up to be run professionally with people who, have the mindset of where this is, where we're trying to take this. And it's not a hobby, right? There's not that sports fan mentality of running the business and they're trying to really do it in a proper manner. And it's well thought out. Then I said, you know what? That's a league that I may have interest in.

Also economically, the bet that was made at the time was not a very expensive bet, relatively speaking to what other sports teams go for. It was very small, minimal. So I was willing to take a chance because the cost basis was very low and I got to know the league operators and what changes were coming in terms of personnel. So I really, you you're also investing in people. It's not just the concept in the sport.

you're investing in the structure and the people that are running the structure and putting it together, you're putting stake into that. So I'm looking at that as well. And I said, you know what, I think they're going in a good direction. I said the cost basis at the time for buying the license was very low. We didn't have to put a lot of cash on the balance sheet at the time to carry the club for a while. So I thought it was a risk worth taking and it's so far been very good.

And it's continued and I've actually made subsequent investments in pickleball, not in professional teams, in operating businesses in Texas and in Florida.

Sean Callanan (26:34.99)

And is that a bit of that diversification because it's not all, you know, it's obviously a sport that has multiple facets, whether they be facilities where people, you know, people play, you know, people book their courts, all that, like you can start seeing that, this is going to be a sport that has momentum. There is going to be a whole infrastructure, you know, in the same way that tennis does. Is that how you look at it from an investment point of view?

Romie Chaudhari (26:54.505)

Yes.

Romie Chaudhari (26:58.472)

So yeah, when you can leverage other assets that can tie into your sports team, by all means, you should, I advise doing that. And I do look for opportunities to try to do that. And in pickleball, I actually am a part owner of a very large facility in Fort Lauderdale called the Fort. And it's a great destination for a pickleball team to call home.

Only problem is we signed a deal with the APP, which is a rival league. So I'm a part of the PPA, but we have a deal with the APP for the facility. I tried to make that the whole for my pick a ball club, but we couldn't we couldn't do it because of the deal with the APP. But that would be a perfect scenario where even even that that's the case. All the pros come down there to train and play still. But yeah, anytime you can do it, you try to leverage your assets.

to get any competitive advantage that you can.

Sean Callanan (28:01.238)

You spoke earlier about, you know, the Atlanta Hawks thing is just sort of first for a and being part of a group. In some of these, you've been the one man in and others you've sort of been part of a group. What what do you look for when you're looking for a partner, you know, on a on a deal or, you know, being being part of a group that's putting in a bid or making an acquisition? What do you look for in your partners?

Romie Chaudhari (28:20.906)

you know, it's fairies, but like in a, in a perfect world, you know, I really have three simple questions that I ask, you know, internally I ask, okay, do, do, do I like the person? Do I trust the person and do they bring value to the relationship? Then I ask, well, do they like me?

Do they trust me? And do they think I bring value? Right? And do I honestly feel I bring value? Right? So if the usually the answer is yes to two out of the three questions. But you really if you want to be totally objective, you got to be totally objective and say, well, is it yes to all three? If it's yes to all three? Well, that's a recipe for success.

in a partnership. It's a very simple test that I do, but I try to be very objective and thoughtful about it and just say, OK, if I can like the person, trust them and they bring value in order for me to like it, trust me is their moral compass must be similar. Remember, I talked about moral compass earlier. Well, the moral compass is similar to mine then, you know, and if I feel they're adding value, well, now it's smart money that's at the table. Right. That's how I look at it. And I want to be that to them as well. So that's that's the metrics. Those are the metrics that I use in looking for partners.

And every partner that I have in my group pretty much, they're friends too, right? I mean, they're my friends as well. people say, don't do business with your friends. I actually have had my best deals happen with friends.

Sean Callanan (30:02.712)

Well, you've got to keep working with them. like you said, if you don't like them, it doesn't make for a pleasant experience.

Romie Chaudhari (30:09.132)

Yes, right. Exactly. Exactly. I try to I try, you know, and sometimes you might say, well, I like the person is my friend. And so you might be a little more forgiving on other elements of the partnership that matter. So that's where you have to be very objective and say, OK, yes, it's my friend. But it's business also. there's got to be, you know, a march in the same direction. There has to be certain hurdles there, Matt. And, you know, it's not just about

being friends, you have to be able to also add some value. again, I only ask that of others if I can deliver that myself. I don't want to be a hypocrite and say, OK, I want you to bring all this to the table, even though I don't bring anything to the table. No, I like it to be we both we're all kicking together.

Sean Callanan (30:59.246)

Is there anything sort of, you looking forward, especially in that sports investment scene in the, in the team and leagues, we're seeing, you know, new leagues, completely new leagues pop up, you know, that are self-contained and people will be part of it. We're seeing different investment vehicles going into sport, whether it be the SPACs or, or, know, NFL teams talking about, you know, just cutting off a little piece and letting people be, you know, be a small investor and even some, you know, talking about going to IPO. What are your thoughts on

what the future might hold in the world of sports investment specifically.

Romie Chaudhari (31:31.817)

Yeah, I this category sports in general is just on fire. All the private equity firms are setting up all these, like you mentioned earlier, these SPACs and all these different investment vehicles to buy into these franchises. I mean, there's no shortage of content out there. I will say there's a demand. There's a demand for it. you I hate to go back to that time because it's very dark time, but COVID was a very strong indicator of how

much content like sports, live sports mattered to people, especially during that time. Everybody still wanted to know that that's one of the reasons why I love this investment investing in sports in general is it's uncorrelated to any other asset class that's out there. Right? The whole market that could take a dump, the stock market could suck the real estate market could say everything could be trashed. People still want to watch games.

They still want to watch those games, right? So, so in COVID was perfect evidence of that. There was nothing else you could do. People were starving for content. And so that never went away. And so I really, I really feel like there's really still so much room to grow. just, I mean, look, some leagues are way more mature than others. The NBA is shot through the roof. Team value is just continued to skyrocket.

Sean Callanan (32:29.549)

Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (32:55.293)

and there are other leads that like, you know, like it's one of the things that I liked about the NDA is, is it's a very, very good league. and team valuations are a fraction of what they are at the NDA level. we're just scratching the surface of media rights, you know? and I just, I think that, you know, these secondary leagues, there's a lot of room to grow in some of those. Right. And so.

I just think there's a lot more potential in this. as as some of this professional money starts to look beyond the United States and they start looking in other countries and other regions, you know, it also is going to help shape how leagues and teams work together, work with one another. Right. So, like, for example, we're in Australia, there's an opportunity to now do potentially like a like a Euro league, but an Asian like a super league in Asia where you can start doing things very creatively.

Well, you put money behind those sort of things. There's a lot of different things you can start doing. And so there's a lot of potential still. And I'm excited about being part of that space.

Sean Callanan (34:03.884)

Well, I appreciate you coming on, Romie. I want to get to the Sportsgeek Closing Five before we wrap up. Do you remember the first sports event you ever attended?

Romie Chaudhari (34:13.83)

Yep. my, uh, is the only game. So the basketball game, was a boss of Celtics against the Washington Bullets at the time. It was, it was in 1986. I was 12 years old. My dad.

Sean Callanan (34:28.802)

was Celtics, one of the Celtics best teams. That's, Bird, McHale and that, that era, that would have been absolute treat.

Romie Chaudhari (34:31.491)

Yes. Yeah.

Yeah, it was either 86, 87, was around there. And I just remember it was the only game I ever went to as a kid. I never went to a game until I, after that, I went to one game. I never went to a game until I went to graduate school in Los Angeles when I was about 27. That was my first basketball game. But this was my first game before that and the only game. And I still remember the day my dad took me, drove me to Boston and my seats were…

Sean Callanan (34:58.637)

Yep.

Romie Chaudhari (35:05.797)

They were on the, in the nosebleeds, the 300 section at the old Boston garden. And I was behind the big AC units, HVAC units. So it was an obstructed view. So I could only see like two thirds of the court, but Larry Bird had 49 points that night and played one of the best games he's ever played. And I just still remember I had binoculars. I, it was a kid, man. And I just fell in love. I said, man, this is such a treat and so much fun.

And to this day, I still remember, just tell my dad, I man, thank you so much for that. And he feels bad. like, I wish I could have done more for you. But he's like, it's what we could do. And it was so much fun. So that was my one sporting event, my first one.

Sean Callanan (35:48.532)

That's a terrific memory. You know, to see Larry Bird put up a 40 burger would be a treat. There's been, you obviously been to lots of different sports events now. Do you have a favourite food memory or a go-to food at a sports event?

Romie Chaudhari (35:54.285)

Yeah. Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (36:03.267)

mmm. I'd say, you know what, it's gonna sound a little bougie. like, so I went to the best food I've ever had was at the LA Rams in their new stadium. They had like gourmet sushi in there, man. Like it was great. Yeah, I mean, the typical answer is hot dog and pizza, but I actually liked that. Yeah.

Sean Callanan (36:18.978)

Yep, it's so fly. Yeah.

No, that's fine. I do do say food memory because the the food game in the world of sports, it keeps keeps going up. I mean, you can say Dodger Dog, it's quite valid. But you're I think you're the second person in the last couple of episodes that said sushi. So again, it's not it's not my go to food at a sports event. But if you love your sushi, and that's giving the fans what they want as part of the experience, you know, you want to be able to go to game and have sushi and take in a game. So completely understand. Managing or being an owner of teams in different parts of the world.

Romie Chaudhari (36:30.966)

Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (36:48.609)

Right.

Sean Callanan (36:54.978)

You know, you're in Miami, is there, what's the app you open first thing in the morning?

Romie Chaudhari (37:00.492)

I will look after I'd say my WhatsApp. I have my routine. It's my emails, text messages, WhatsApp. And the app that I use, I really don't do much social media or anything like that, but I've become a little bit active on Twitter. And so that's yeah.

Sean Callanan (37:20.407)

Okay.

Terrific, terrific. Is there someone, I always ask people if there's an author or someone they follow, might be on Twitter, that you think that the listeners should give a follow and why?

Romie Chaudhari (37:31.85)

You know, I really like listening to Simon Sinek. I listen to him a lot. He really just gives perspectives. It's like there's always a brightness of view for looking at things and perspectives. And it's just very enlightening and very refreshing, especially given that the world we live in today. I really enjoy the gifts that he brings on there and just some of the things that

they talk about and the things that they say matter to them or things that matter to me. So I really, that's one person that I listen to.

Sean Callanan (38:11.522)

I mean, his big success is start with why. I mean, is it something you've worked on? Do you know what your why is?

Romie Chaudhari (38:19.614)

That's a deep question, You know, that wire has changed over time because now I have a family now, right? I have a child. Everything's changed now because I have a child. But that's a deep question. You know, look, we have one life, only one. There's no dress rehearsal for life. So one thing I just, my wire is I just want to say, listen, I just want to…

Sean Callanan (38:23.151)

It is…

Sean Callanan (38:29.472)

It… Yep. Yep.

Romie Chaudhari (38:47.611)

I want to make the most of whatever years I have here. I want to be happy. I want to be healthy. I don't want to hurt anybody. I want to help others. And I want to be a good example. My why now is why am I here is to teach my child how to survive in this world and how to enjoy the ride and how to be good to others and maybe be better than me at doing that and fine, you know, and just teach her what I can. And I feel

That's why I'm here now. I think it's to share everything, whatever I've been able to build, to share it with her and my family and friends. It's about enjoying the journey while you get to wherever it is you go in life. I just want to enjoy the ride the whole way.

Sean Callanan (39:34.676)

Absolutely, absolutely. And a terrific answer for one that I just threw you on the spot there. Last one, and you might have teased it a little bit, but what social media platform is your MVP? What's the one that is your go-to?

Romie Chaudhari (39:44.955)

Yeah, it's I really only use I use LinkedIn every now and then not that actively, but a lot of people reach out to me on LinkedIn. But I've for better or worse, I've gotten in. I've started using Twitter a little bit and.

Sean Callanan (39:54.968)

Yep.

Sean Callanan (40:04.43)

Yep. As long as you recognize the for better and worse, that's the main thing, I think, I mean, because it can be a platform for good, but you can take a wrong turn sometimes and it can get you into trouble. And I know it's got me into trouble occasionally, but it's also brought me some great friends and connects and things like that. And it's not exactly what it was once, but to each their own.

Romie Chaudhari (40:10.125)

Yeah!

Romie Chaudhari (40:15.214)

Yes.

Romie Chaudhari (40:24.367)

Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (40:29.006)

Yeah, yeah, I actually I agree with you on that that that that Twitter probably probably isn't what it what it used to be. And you have to be careful. There's only so many characters you can put on there. So it's like you got to you got to be careful how you work things and things like that. But I do think it's it's it's been a good platform, depending on what your purpose is for mine. It's really just to.

to talk about things with the basketball. I don't really talk about anything else other than our team and the club and some of the things happening in basketball. if I think it's gonna be, you know, even if I've got some snarky stuff that I say, there's always intent behind it it's not malicious towards anybody or any particular person. I'm stating, oftentimes I say, I'll state things that other people all think, but they just won't say.

And so I'll do that sometimes.

Sean Callanan (41:24.942)

Terrific. Well, Romie, I really do appreciate you coming to the podcast. I'll put links to your LinkedIn. Is that the best way for people to, you know, normally say to people who listen to reach out to say thank you is LinkedIn probably the best platform to people to tell you that they've listened to the podcast.

Romie Chaudhari (41:38.464)

That's what, that would be great. Sure. LinkedIn is great. Yeah. LinkedIn or Twitter or either one.

Sean Callanan (41:48.492)

Well, thank you very much. Let me know when you're next in Melbourne. I'm only a short walk down from where. Thank you very much. That's that's thank you very much.

Romie Chaudhari (41:51.934)

I love, by the way, I love your backdrop. I love the backdrop. It's very cool. I gotta get you a jersey. I need to get you a, I need to get you a Melbourne Phoenix jersey. We gotta get you one.

Sean Callanan (42:04.11)

Well, there go. There you go. The ruse works. That's exactly what the ruse, that's why the wall is there to get a jersey. I'd happily accept one and let me know when you're next in Melbourne. I'll take you to my favourite pub that's not far from where the Phoenix games are.

Romie Chaudhari (42:16.448)

Perfect. Have you been to a gay?

Sean Callanan (42:20.142)

I have been to a game, I've been to a few games, but yeah, it's like you said, it's a great spectacle, put on a great show and the NBL is going from strength to strength and Phoenix would be part of that. Currently sitting top two in the ladder at the moment.

Romie Chaudhari (42:21.204)

Yeah.

Romie Chaudhari (42:32.53)

Any? Yeah, yeah, top two. I know we had a tough tough loss. Melbourne United has our number. They've had our number and I think one of them, I think they're like 21 and nine against us. So we got to figure that one out.

Sean Callanan (42:51.118)

All right. Thanks, Romie. Appreciate you coming on.

Romie Chaudhari (42:53.174)

All right, thank you so much.