SGP 040: Oscar Ugaz on #digisport trends and David Morris #Sochi2014 Silver Medallist

Oscar Ugaz chats about his time at Real Madrid on Sports Geek PodcastOn this week’s podcast we chat with Oscar Ugaz about the European sports digital scene and his time at Real Madrid.  Included in this episode is a sneak peek at our interview with David Morris Sochi silver medalist in the aerials from our chat on Beers, Blokes & Business.

Play

Like this episode? please leave a review in iTunes.

Looking to improve your skills in social media? Come along to our Sports Geek Social Media One Day Educational on March 31st listen to podcast for promo code ($50 off).

On this podcast you’ll find out about:

  • What Oscar thinks the keys are behind connected stadiums
  • How Real Madrid used Facebook gaming to raise money
  • Why YouTube is perfect fit for sports content
  • What the Australian Olympic team learned about social media after London
  • How athletes like David Morris dealt with huge influx of social media attention
  • How Google+ is finding it’s way into sports market
  • How digital fans will be given the Front Row treatment at Old Trafford

David Morris appears on Beers, Blokes & Business, subscribe on iTunesResources from the episode

Social Media Post of the Week

Manchester United announced Front Row an initiative to bring digital fans closer to the players at Old Trafford using Google Hangouts.

Send in your nominations for best social media post of the week – Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Vine… for whatever reason fan engagement, sponsorship activation, cool content….

Closing 2 Cents

 YouTube is ready to take on sports market.  Over 6 billion hours of video are watched each month on YouTube.  That's almost an hour for every person on Earth  @seancallanan from @SportsGeek

Listening via iTunes?

Subscribe to the Sports Geek Podcast in iTunes, if you liked the episode please leave a review on iTunes and help spread the word on your networks.  Thanks in advance.

On SoundCloud?

Follow Sports Geek on Soundcloud, all episodes available.

See you at Sports Geek One Day Educational Social Media Workshop?

Sports Geek Social Media Training One Day Educational

Learn how your business, brand or team can use social media to drive business results.

Find out how I used social media to build Sports Geek and what I teach sports teams to engage fans and sell memberships and tickets.

Listen to podcast for $50 discount promo code.
Find out more

Podcast transcription

Sean: Welcome to Episode 40 of the Sports Geek podcast. On this week’s podcast, we chat with Oscar Ugaz about his time at Real Madrid and what’s next in the world of sports digital in Europe.

We have a quick chat to Olympian and silver medalist, Dave Morris.

DJ Joel: Welcome to the Sports Geek podcast, the podcast built for the sports digital marketer. And now, here’s your host, who suggests you should really rethink that bad password, Sean Callanan.

Sean: Thanks, DJ Joel. That’s right, my name is Sean Callanan, from Sports Geek, and welcome to Episode 40. We’ve made it to the big four-zero. Thank you to everyone who has listened from the get-go. And if you’re just new and checking out the back catalogue, thank you for joining us.

This week on the podcast I chat with a good friend of mine, Oscar Ugaz, who works in digital marketing in Europe. He’s in France at the moment. We talk about his time when he was working with Real Madrid, and some of the things he did there.

Also some of the trends that he is spotting in the world of sports digital, not only in Europe, but also in Latin America. We talk about topics like connected stadium and why YouTube is ready to disrupt the world of sports.

Also a little bit of a sneak peak, we are lucky enough to chat with Winter Olympian and overall good bloke, David Morris. He recently came back from Sochi, winning a silver medal in aerial skiing.

We chatted with him on Beers, Blokes, and Business. That’s going to come out tomorrow, on Monday, so we’ll have a little bit of a snippet of that episode, where we talk about social media and the reaction from fans, and how he dealt with it.

Don’t forget the Sports Geek One-Day Educational is now out. You can check that out at SportsGeekHQ.com/ODE. Stay tuned for some more info on that later in the podcast. We’re going to give you a special promo code. But first, here’s my chat with Oscar Ugaz from France.

I’m very pleased to welcome Oscar onto the Sports Geek podcast. I caught up to him a couple of years ago via Skype before I had a podcast, so I’m really happy to have him on. Oscar Ugaz is in France today. Oscar, welcome to the podcast.

Oscar: Thank you very much, Sean. Thanks for having me.

Sean: And you are in France today?

Oscar: Yes, today we are in a winter day in France. Very, very nice.

Sean: First of all, just to introduce yourself to the listeners, if they follow @SportsBiz on Twitter, or @DigiSport, they might have seen your Twitter handle, @OscarUgaz, pop up every now and again. But do you want to give everyone a little bit of a background of your story in sports and digital?

Oscar: Oh, yes, of course. I have an experience of 15 years in digital. I am a former advertising executive working for Wunderman; I am still working with them. But in 2007, I was hired by Real Madrid to be the Digital Business Manager, and I worked with them for several years establishing the digital strategy that nowadays the club has in place.

From that point on, I have been in the sports field and I have been working on advising other sports organization since then, since I left the club.

Sean: It must have been a really exciting phase, because you’re really in that spot around the same time I started Sports Geek. It was a little bit after that, but it was really around the time that social networks really developed. Facebook came along and Twitter came along, and sports teams started to adapt that. Were there some real lessons in those early years in moving from pure digital to what we now know as social media?

Oscar: Yes, indeed. We are talking about 2007. Now in 2007, where Facebook and Twitter are not the size that they are nowadays. They are not as well known as they are nowadays. In that time also, for example, Real Madrid, the data case that I worked on, Real Madrid has not developed a big digital strategy.

They have their portal. They have made some very, very specific analytics for mobile. When we started to develop this new strategy for them, the first thing we do is the website, and stuff like that.

But at some moment, we say, “You know, we are in 2007 and there are these new behaviors in people. People are using these new platforms, this new social media. People are engaging; people are talking. Why don’t we enter into that sphere?”

There was also always a fear – and this is still a fear in most sports organizations and in some brands – that we don’t want to go there because we are afraid of losing contracts, stuff like that.

But after a discussion, and we insist, insist, and we convince them. We start to have a presence on Facebook and Twitter, just like a test. At the beginning it was a test to see how fans behave in these environments where they can speak and have an opinion.

Then we will see if we can translate that to our website, our official web portals. At the end of the day, the social media and the social media environments became a big monster on their own. They had their own lives, so we decided to start creating strategies, and created a specific force and a specific business around these social media environments.

Sean: So you’ve moved on from Real now. You’re in a consulting business working in digital marketing. How much of your work now is still in the sports space?

Oscar: Nowadays I work in Latin America and in Europe. Let’s say that around 50% of the job that I am doing right now is related to sports. We are working with some sports clubs in Latin America, and we are also advising some organizations in Germany, and also in Spain.

It is 50% of our job right now, but it is most of the same. It is based on digital and how these organizations can take advantage of these new platforms, and these new solutions.

Sean: So how has the transition for you been a different go from what we would call “Club Land,” working for a team, and just for their purposes to, one, being in the same space as me, working with multiple teams? But then, also, working with these multiple industries, or brands, and governments, and those kinds of things? How much of that digital strategy and the work that you are doing in digital is applicable and transferable across those industries?

Oscar: I think that many, many things are very transferable. For example, when they’re related to sports, at the end of the day, it is a business. You need to develop some kind of value. It is obvious that you need that.

But at the end of the day, all of the things nowadays in digital are based in content. It doesn’t matter if you are selling sports, if you are selling a country, a tourist destination, or a car. I am working in all of these industries.

What you need in all of these situations is content. If you don’t have relevant and remarkable content, it is very difficult to have an impact in digital or in social media. Because nowadays, it’s a word that everyone is using, it’s “content”, but it’s real.

If you don’t have nowadays something interesting to tell in the digital sphere, you have nothing. Because you are not getting attention, and without attention, you are not going to be able to transform that into eventual sales, or into eventual value to the company.

That’s a problem that you confront in any business that you are in nowadays, that if you want to activate it in digital. So I think that experience that we have with a brand like Real that is very big and has all the attention, but in some ways has big difficulties to create content beyond the football match.

You have the football match; it is big content, but its content has already been sold to that tenant of the rights. It is the guy who is paying you the big amounts for broadcast rights.

You say, “Okay, how can I create more content? Something different to try to bring more attention, and try to transform that new attention into money. Because how can I create additional business out of the social media?”

That’s the same problem that, for example, tourist boards, or car dealers, or whoever you think of, all have the same content problem.

Sean: Definitely over the last three to four years, that explosion of content has happened across the board. Sports teams are overflowing with content, but still you’ve got to shape that content for your fans in a way that they can consume it. Because all sports teams, whether they be Real Madrid or the Melbourne Storm or the LA Lakers, they’re competing against these other content engines and content companies that are now coming up and competing with sports teams.

Whether they be USA For The Win, or GrantLand.com, or anything like that, the sports teams can’t just be putting out the vanilla met report, or the press conference, they’ve got to be in that – like you just said – remarkable and interesting content to engage their fans. Otherwise, the fans just start tuning out.

Oscar: Yes, that’s very true. The problem is, I am talking about football clubs in Europe and in Latin America. These people have very big difficulties creating relevant and remarkable content. I am not talking about the United States, for example, because in the States, they have been very creative, and they are willing to test new stuff.

In Europe and football in Latin America, beyond the match, the highlights, the training footage or stuff like that, there are very, very few examples of people creating some content by thinking out of the box.

I think that one of the very great and big examples are Manchester City, for example. Manchester City is a club that is creating concepts like the tunnel cam, or are creating concepts like, “Okay, we are going to play the training match using GoPro cameras.” Stuff like that.

I think because they are not in the front lines–they are not the first, and the biggest, and the most popular football club in the premier¬¬–I know it is important but they don’t have anything to lose. They say, “Okay, we are going to test things.” That is the attitude. That is the attitude that you have to take, you know I think that they are doing pretty, pretty well.

Sean: We have definitely seen an insatiable appetite for sports fans, definitely here in Australia, and the same in the States, in the U.S., in the pro teams in the more content the teams produce. We’ve seen it as digital teams have grown. They’ve gone from one to two-person man teams.

As they put in more content producers, the numbers, the traffic, it all increases because the fans have this insatiable desire. From what you are saying, to me, that sounds like a massive opportunity for all the teams to follow the leads of the Manchester Cities, to produce that extra content. Because their fans are craving for it. They just don’t know if the opportunity was there, if that content was produced for them, that they would be consuming that more and more.

Oscar: There is also a big constraint there. It is not only based in the resources you have to pour inside the club more producers and more budget to create that. It is also, I think, about attitude and about conceptual openness to do these types of tasks. Because most of the content created by the club is created by press areas that are very traditional in the way that they manage.

The guys who, for example, are creating outstanding and incredible content around football, in YouTube, for example. It is driving millions and millions and millions of fans of people who are not football clubs. I don’t know if you know them.

Sean: Yes.

Oscar: These are guys who are creating relevant content. They are creating concepts like the football fan, the guy who goes around the games and shows the behind-the-scenes, or the bowels, of the club. Or, I don’t know, the guys who make fans and make rap battles between Ronaldo and Messi, and stuff like that. It is driving huge, huge, huge amounts of traffic and of attention.

That is an arena in which a football club finds it very difficult to enter. Not only because they are traditional. It is also because they have, “Okay, now, we have to protect the image of the players. We have to protect the image of this thing and the other.” You have a lot of constraints, and that’s why you are sometimes forced to create not so interesting and relevant content.

That is a barrier that in some moment needs to be broken down, because if not, all the traffic is going to go to these other creative types, you know, who are creating the content that people nowadays are following.

Sean: Another question that I’m really looking forward to when I’m in Europe is checking out some of the stadiums and seeing what the trends are at stadiums, both in London and in Europe. There is a really big debate in the U.S. at the minute, around connected stadiums.

As you know, I’m part of SEAT Conference where I run the digital track. They’re always talking about Wi-Fi and DAS, and can the fans get access to the Internet. It’s becoming a necessity in the States. We’ve also got CISCO rolling out some networks with some of the major stadiums in Australia, because of the demands that so many fans with smartphones want to be able to do things.

There have been an interesting, I guess, opposing points of view. Mark Cuban, the owner of the Mavericks is really in the camp of, “I don’t want my fans using their phones. I want them to be engaged with the action.”

Then you’ve got the new Kings’ owner, who wants to provide that fan as much Internet as they need, so they can have that extra, contextual benefit of being at the game. It might be live replays that you can pull up on your smartphone.

So they are sort of the two opposite ends of the spectrum that are currently happening in the U.S.. What’s the connected stadium debate like, happening in Europe and in Latin America?

Oscar: I think that in Latin America they are still not in that level of connecting the stadiums. In Europe there are many, many things that are entering into this environment. I think, not because they are thinking in a strategic way, like in the States. But mostly because other ones are doing it.

That is a bad thing about all this digital. “Oh, because my competitor is doing it, I am going to do it also. Because I cannot say that I am not a connected stadium and the team that I fight every Sunday, the other team has it.”

That is the situation right now. I think that both Mr. Cuban and the people who are opposite to him in these things are both right. I think that in these stadiums you have this big problem of people saying “Why go to the stadium if I can sit on my coach, or in my armchair, and I have my big, plasma screen, with my tablet, and all the things, and I get all the information there?”

You have to give them reasons to go to the stadium. Some of the reasons will be that you have the same connectivity and you are going to use the same multimedia options in the stadium. “Come on over here.”

On the other hand, I think that Mr. Cuban is very right. The thing that you cannot do is go to the stadium – and I think that that is happening in some of the stadiums in the States – that you go to the stadium and you sit down in a very big room, like at your house.

You sit down there and you pass all the time watching not the game, but also watching what is happening in other four or five games, at the same time, and playing fantasy games. Because at the end of the day, that is not the experience of a match. I think that both are extremes, that you cannot fall in one extreme or the other, because it is not healthy.

The other thing I think about connected stadiums is that it’s great, you have to provide this content to the fans, these services. But I think that is something that is very expensive. And if the football clubs do not have a good strategy on how to extract money out of it, or how to extract value–and believe me, many, many clubs do not have them, at least in Europe–it is going to be a very big, and expensive, nice-to-have thing.

I think if you want to extract value out of a connected stadium, the first thing that you must have is a very compelling and very well-established CRM strategy. To know, okay, these guys came in, they bought these things. I can put that in the database; I can have all this information. I can see how I can construct insights and information, and I can create new products to sell these guys. Because this is not just, “Okay, I have it; it’s very nice, but it’s very expensive. But I have connection, Wi-Fi in the stadium.” It does not make any sense.

There are football teams, for example, in Europe, where these are projects that are developed by the IT department of the club. But for example, the guys and the sponsorship do not know how to extract value out of that. They don’t have the tools to say, “Okay, how can I use this Internet connection inside the stadium to maybe sell some new products for the sponsor?”

It’s part of the silo culture of many clubs in Europe, you know. IT is one area, and it is totally separated from sponsorship, and it’s totally separated from digital marketing. They work separately; they don’t talk to each other.

One of these projects is a totally technical, IT project. The other guys don’t know how to activate it. So that is one of the other big constraints about this.

Sean: Definitely, yes. It is something that even the first time I went to SEAT in 2011, it was all the IT guys. That was one of my first conversations with Christine after that, saying, “We really need to get the marketers in here at this same conference”, because the IT guys will set up the great systems, but it is the marketing guys who will implement these activations and sponsorships that close the loop.

Oscar: That is not happening, right now. Unfortunately, from my experience, that is not happening, right now.

Sean: Yes, so last year in Kansas City, the guys at Sporting KC, and Sporting Innovations, pretty much used the sporting park, where Sporting KC play, as a really good example of, one, what a connected stadium can be, in that their smartphone app would connect to their Wi-Fi.

As you walked around the stadium, different offers would come to your phone because they knew where you were in the stadium. I think there was a shot-on-goal, and literally, by the time I had taken the phone out of my pocket and brought it up, I was able to see a replay of that.

Now, they are in a really great situation, and I’ve got to get Asim from Sporting Innovations on the podcast to talk about it. But it is that N2N solution, and there are so many moving parts of getting the TV guys to work with your digital, getting the infrastructure of the stadium, but when it does come off, it does fit really well for the fan. That’s the end.

But the other thing is, with the Sporting KC model, it was all connected to their CRM. So they were always getting more data about their fan, to better serve that fan better offers, better deals, those kinds of things, while always profiling those fans.

Oscar: At the end of day, you have to envision some type of return, because we are talking about a very, very expensive investment to create this infrastructure. So who is going to pay for that party? Someone needs to pay for that.

Maybe it’s a sponsor, okay, but the sponsor will need to have options, and will need to have tools to activate that. “Okay, I am going to sponsor, and I am going to pay for this. How am I going to have a return?”

It’s something that needs to be very clear. I think that very few people are making that exercise nowadays in the sports properties. They are just implementing the infrastructure because everyone is doing it. And it is something that is very, very sad to have happening.

Sean: It does take you to that ROI question. We’ve all been playing – I don’t know if I want to say “playing” – but working in social for a couple of years, now, and that ROI question keeps coming up. I think social, overall, is a longer game, and you can measure the ROI on a campaign-by-campaign basis, running specific things. That’s how you can start measuring ROI. But what are some of the things you look for when somebody says, “We want to run this campaign, but we want to make sure it brings in returns?”

Oscar: I think that one of the things on which you need to focus here is how are you’re going to measure value, when you create these companies.

For example, it’s a sponsor campaign, and the sponsor says, “I’m going to measure my values in,” I don’t know, “‘likes’ or comments.” Well, it is this problem; I think that is the most superficial thing that you can do.

I think that you have to create experiences for the fans, but that have a revenue stream behind them. That’s the thing that happened when we created, for example, in Madrid, the Real Madrid Fantasy Manager.

We said, “We have all these millions of fans on Facebook and we have all these thousands of guys that are using our mobile application. Where are these people in 2010? What are these people doing now in social platforms or in mobile?

They are playing FarmVille, or they are playing Mafia Wars. Now we are talking about 2010, when Zynga was very popular. Okay, if we have this, why don’t we create, again, a social media game?

The thing that we do is we act like normal, licensing guys. We go and we talk with Zynga and they say to us, “We are not interested. We are focusing on our own games.”

So we decided that we would make a complete reverse engineering of that game. We sit down with the developers of those games, who have experience creating fantasy games. Together with these guys, we make a reverse engineering of these Mafia Wars, of this FarmVille, and we mix that with a social media game.

And we create the Fantasy Manager, a game that has been very popular and has demonstrated that Real can extract money out of that fan base, because we started bringing real money out of that thing.

So that is something is not in any other clubs. You have people that have the capacity to sit down, do that exercise, and do that reverse-engineering of a game. Because at the end of the day, you say, “No, you are digital guys. What you need to do is start to close licenses.”

You have to think in some other way, you know. You have to think in some other way. At the end of the day, also, this Fantasy Manager game nowadays is played by over 30 teams around the world. You know, because Real created that game, we the team of digital, created that game, Real earns a royalty for each one of these games.

You are playing a game, for example, the AC Milan Fantasy Game, and you are making money out of that. A percentage of the money that AC Milan is making goes to Real, because Real was the creator of the game. So Real Madrid transformed themselves into a publisher of games. Who says that a football club needs to be a publisher of games? Why not?

Sean: And we have seen that with Major League Baseball events media, a lot of teams and leagues are setting up their own digital media departments, both as a content producing house, but then also spinning off and doing those games and fantasy games, and those kinds of things because it is still focused on revenue.

Fantasy is still one of the biggest traffic drivers on a lot of sports. So there is money to be made form an advertising point of view, having premium versions.

I’ve heard Peter Stringer talk about similarly, their 3-Point Play Facebook app around the same time, was a really great way early on, when those games on Facebook were starting to really catch on. It worked really well and tied into their CRM strategy perfectly.

Oscar: Yes, but there you are thinking out of the box, you know. The other example is the all-night video. We arrive in Madrid, we say, “We are the only football club that does not have a paying, all-night, video channel. We are the only club who does not have it. Why don’t we make it?

So we started making all the analysis, and we discover that we lose money. We lose money because we are asking all the other people, all the other clubs that have these types of solutions. And they say, “People nowadays are pirating the content, so we are losing money.”

We say, “We don’t have the content. We are not going to have the possibility of creating a channel. We are going to lose money.” And what happened?

It was 2010. YouTube appears, with YouTube Partner Program. You can upload your content and what do you do? YouTube will start selling advertising over the content that you create. What happens, 50% is for you, and 50% is for YouTube.

But the most interesting thing is that YouTube has this technology that allows you to say, if someone is using your content – let’s say that I, a football club upload my match, and I don’t publish it to YouTube. It’s there.

But there is a guy who takes five seconds to make, I don’t know what, a resume of the best goals. The system identifies that he is using five seconds of my content. They say, “This is the content of Real.” And “Real, you have two options. You can say ‘Block it’, or you can say ‘Sell advertising, and I want to have 50%’.”

At the end of the day, you are using this great technology of YouTube, not to fight with the fans. Because the fans want to take the content, want to take the match. They want to take the interview; they want to make their version. They want to make match-ups.

You say, “Do the match-ups. I am not going to fight you, because it’s impossible to fight with thousands of guys. Do it, you are free, but in the meantime, I am going to make money out of it.”

Sean: Definitely, I’m a big believer. I think YouTube will become a bigger player in sports. They had a very successful campaign with the IPL doing that. And it is rumored that they may try to get some of the NFL, which would be a really big reach.

But yes, the fact that it’s a platform that works; it’s a platform that everyone is consuming their video on. And yes, the ID-matching ability they’ve got, we went through the same when we launched the Lego Car video.

It pretty much says, “Yes, we found another video that someone stole it.” And you have that option to get it shut down and send everyone back to your site, or leave it out there and let the fans consume it. I think that’s a really progressive way of thinking about it. Why wouldn’t you want to monetize your content on all these different ways?

Oscar: And the thing that you have just said is very, very important. Because, indeed, maybe in the future, YouTube is going to be a potential tenant of rights. It is going to be a dealer of the rights, okay. And there is the opportunity; there is where you’re going to take the revenue.

If YouTube, let’s say, in five years, came to a football club and said, “I want to buy your rights. I’m going to pay you $10. And you are going to remain in that position today.” “No, no, no. The value of that is not $10; the value of that is $15.”

You Tube is going to ask you how you know that, and you are going to say, “I now that because over the past five years I have been on your platform and I know the real value of that.” That is the moment when all these efforts and details are going to pay off. It is not going to pay off now.

It’s the same thing that happened with Real, for example. Five years ago, Real started doing all these social media platforms, and one of the guys that entered more into this type of thing was Bwin.

Bwin is company that is in betting, but it is also in entertaining and being the entertainment. It was a sponsor of the shirts. Last year the shirt contract ended, but Bwin did not walk away. Bwin said, “I am out of the shirt, but I want to be the official partner/sponsor of digital Real Madrid.

That happened after five years, before, of working with these guys, working with them, making the Fantasy Manager. Showing it to them and saying, “Here you have insight; here you have information. I am not just sending you an email at the end of the campaign saying how many ‘likes’ you have, how many ‘comments’.”

“No, I am sending you a deck, a complete deck, telling you and informing you of the things that you did in the campaign. Maybe next time you have to do this to obtain more revenue, or more results.” Stuff like that.

That creates a different relationship with that partner. That’s why now, five years after that, after you have started making all those social media that don’t pay off, nowadays, it is paying off. Because you have retained a sponsor that is paying you for this digital platform, and because of these digital efforts that you are making, that were not paying off, now are paying off, after five years.

It’s not money, right now. It’s not, “I am going to create an application and I’m going to make money, money, money all the days, as usual.” No, you have to think differently. You are going to take the value in some other, different way, in the middle- to long-term.

Sean: Definitely, I think we’re on the same page. I definitely think it is long game. The thing that social allows you to do is it allows you to take your fans along on that journey. And wherever you end up, they are already going to be there, because they’re going to be following you on all those different platforms that they’re following you on now. And who knows, there might be a couple of platforms that are being built right now. Whether that’s in Silicon Valley, or somewhere in Europe, or even in Australia.

Oscar: This is called the “innovator’s dilemma”. It happens in any industry. The innovation comes in little segments, in little business models that don’t work, that bring in very little money. So big companies don’t pay attention to that. Obviously, they don’t pay attention to that because the big money is in some other place.

Football clubs don’t pay attention nowadays to the Internet, because the say, “How much are you making? You are making maybe $20,000,000 a year. I make $20,000,000 just signing a deal with a sponsor.” No, they don’t pay attention.

The problem is, when this social media, this digital, begins transforming something big and you are not prepared. That is what has happened, you name it, it has happened with the book industry, the music industry. It has happened with the mining industries. Any industry where technology has entered, it has happened.

It is something that is called the “innovator’s dilemma”, and it is a concept that has been around for many, many years. Now it is happening here. What is happening here is going to happen.

You have to be prepared. It is normal. It is normal that marketing doesn’t pay attention to you. It is normal that you are just five guys in digital, the five crazy guys in digital that no one is paying attention to, that no one is giving you a budget. It’s normal. But the thing is that they need to fight against this innovation dilemma.

One big example, and great example, that did this ten years ago, in breaking the innovation dilemma in sports and now are doing great is MLB. MLBAM are a great example of breaking the innovation dilemma and doing great things for the Major League of Baseball. It is a great example of this.

Sean: Exactly, and that gives me a good time to wrap up our discussion. I know we could talk longer, but I hope that our schedules allow us to catch up when I’m in Europe. But if not, I hope that you can make it down to Miami for SEAT. Maybe that is when we continue this discussion.

Oscar: Okay, I hope so. I hope so.

Sean: Thank you very much for coming on the podcast, Oscar. I will have links to your Twitter handle, @OscarUgaz and you’re LinkedIn, so if anyone wants to catch up with you, they will be in the show notes for this podcast.

Oscar: Thank you very much, for having me, Sean. See you soon.

Announcer: Sign up for Sports Geek news at SportsGeekHQ.com/signupnow.

Sean: Thanks, again, to Oscar, for joining me on the podcast, all the way from France. Hopefully, I will catch up with him when I’m over in Europe. We’re just trying to organize our diaries to see if we can connect. But as I sort of said there in the conversation, we’re also hoping that he can make it down to SEAT, in Miami in July.

Don’t forget, you can still register for SEAT. I’m working on the digital tracks, and spoke to Christine last week. It looks like it’s going to be a really fun conference. The agenda for the conference, for both the digital, the CIO, the IT track, and also the CRM track run by guys like Russell Scibetti. I hope I got Russell’s name right.

It will be really good to go. Hopefully, we’ll be able to get Oscar to come in and sit on a couple of the panels. You can also check that out at SportsGeekHQ.com/SGP. And all the links to Oscar will be in the show notes. So definitely connect with him and follow what he does on Twitter, and LinkedIn, and the like.

This week, also, we had an Olympian turn up to the Sports Geek offices. Dave Morris, who, if you’ve been following the Sochi Olympics, especially in Australia, he won the silver medal for the aerial skiing. He is a friend of one of the blokes, so we had a chat with him, and here is a little bit of a snippet from that chat.

Unfortunately, we had some technical difficulties when recording, so it was recording on our back-up track, so it’s a little bit tinny. But he does give up some insights on what it’s like when you are inundated with social media mentions and requests around a big event like the Olympics. Dave Morris, Olympian.

Sean: So I have a question from a Sports Geek point of view. At the London Olympics, the swimmers and swimming team sort of blamed social media for their downfall. In that they were reading too many tweets; it got in their heads. I guess, you have just now lived that. What was it like in the lead-up to? We’ve already said that you were flying under the radar, but there would have been tweets coming in.

Dave: Absolutely, yes.

Sean: And stuff like that. What did you do to manage that? And the second question is, what was it like afterwards?

Dave: The Australian Olympic Committee really learned from London and the mistakes – I say “mistakes” – the stuff that went wrong there. Yes, the social media got to a lot of athletes and it was very overwhelming.

So they had what they called basically a “media black out”, which was amped up a little bit more than it was. But it was basically they didn’t want you tweeting or doing any social media while you were at your training venue, whether you were training or competing. Which is very, very fair. People got all arced up about it. I’m like, “But why would you want to be tweeting as you’re ready to go down the end run?” You’re just not concentrating.

Sean: There was a security issue, too, because there was some security issues.

Dave: They didn’t want people saying, “I’m going to this bar.” And then having anyone turn up. I thought it was very fair. You were allowed to tweet in photos, and whatever, once you went back to your room and stuff. That was fine, but they just suggested that it was the best option to just stay totally away from it. Because you do get overwhelmed by it.

Once I got the medal, I got the full brunt of social media in my face. It was three whole days of basically, non-stop. And there’s no way I could have done that before my event, if I’d had any exposure whatsoever. Because, you know, I went under the radar, which was the plan. But guys like, they’re like, “BAM! These guys got a win.” That’s very overwhelming.

Sean: That’s the advice that I’ve given my clients, as sports teams, or with football clubs. They get, you know, I just did a training session with North Queensland Cowboys, and they get that intense pressure over 30 weeks.

Dave: Yes.

Sean: Over a 30-week season. So if Jonathan Thurston has a good game, he gets a flood of tweets coming in. But with the Olympics, you know, they did make a mistake in London and they needed to correct it. They tell you, “Don’t read all the newspapers before you go in.” And that’s all obvious, but they weren’t ready for this new media, to say, “Don’t listen, don’t be tweeting.”

Man: Internet trolls.

Dave: I’ve had the Internet trolls, and my brother helps manage my Facebook fan page. I’ve got people who are just hating me, and I’m like, “What have I done?”

Man: What could they say wrong?

Dave: He deletes it before I read it, because I was going to say before, “Thank you, very much.” But I’m just like, “What have I done to do that?” But I take it as a compliment someone writing to flip me off.

Man: They make fun of you, like the fact that you wear the girls’ uniform, instead of your pants.

Dave: Well, that’s the truth.

Man: Oh, is it true?

Dave: Yes. I wore a woman’s uniform for a couple of years, then you have a boy’s one on. You know, people want to take the time.

Man: We haven’t meant you any kind of trouble.

Sean: You mentioned that your brother helps you with your Facebook fan page. Do you run your Twitter and your Instagram accounts?

Dave: Yes, I do manage my own Twitter, but Dad and my brothers, Pete and Josh, help me out. But that’s true, it’s nice to have them take the load off that. But I make sure I know what’s going on.

But in the games, I went, “You know, I’ll read just a little bit in there.” Because that’s what I do on a daily basis. That’s the routine. But I did really step back from it. I took my pictures as I normally would, but I left it all up until the end. Then, once the matter was done, 980 emails the next morning.

Sean: Wow.

Dave: Like, “All right. Here we go.”

Announcer: Learn from Sports Geek at our Sports Geek ODE One-Day Educational. Got to SportsGeekHQ.com/ODE.

Sean: Thanks, again, to Dave Morris, for coming in to Sports Geek HQ. Again, apologies. Kicking myself for the technical difficulties with the audio. But I guess after 70 episodes, you’re going to have one or two glitches every now and again. But it just shows, especially with audio and video, always have a back-up, and always have a secondary option, otherwise we would have lost it completely.

You can follow Dave @AerialSkier on most platforms. And you can hear that episode in full at BeersBlokesBusiness.com, or you can get that on iTunes and Stitcher. But if you just go to @BeersBlokesBiz on Twitter, you’ll get the latest links for the show.

This week’s social media post of the week, and it’s actually quite topical, considering the conversation I had with Oscar around YouTube and some of the options in that space.

YouTube have announced, from YouTube and Google+, I effectively using the two terms interchangeably, Google+ with Google Hangouts, which is effectively a YouTube product. I see it as a YouTube product. They have announced Google+ Front Row with Manchester United, a means to bring fans from the digital space to Old Trafford.

So I’ll have a link to the show notes of Manchester United announcing that on Facebook and Google+, and the video that Google UK produced to promote the event. The fans will be able to dial in using Google Hangout, and that will actually be shown on the front row at Old Trafford.

So it’s a really good way of connecting digital fans from an online point of view, to the off line, connecting them to the stadium.

Again, I think Google Hangouts, and we’re seeing more and more teams do them, I do think the invite-only and hand-picked fans is the way to go. Manchester United is running effectively a competition to decide which fans will be in that front row.

I think it’s a really great way to engage your fans and bring them back. So I think, everything I’m seeing, from what the Google+ team, and what the Google+ sports team are doing – you saw it with the #sportsconference – they are really trying to push into that sports vertical.

So if you haven’t checked out Google Hangouts and how you could use them, I highly suggest you do because I do think it is going to be, I guess, the one thing that may potentially come out of Google+.

I’m not saying that Google+ is dead, or it’s the next platform to explode, but I definitely like Google Hangouts and the products it offers in the YouTube space. So check that out, Google+ Front Row with Manchester United.

I don’t want to run too long. I’m trying to keep my episodes under 45 minutes, so that clock is ticking to tell me to dedicate Episode 40.

I did have a nomination for Steve Menzies, Manly Sea Eagles legend, coming back at the age of 40 to play in the Sevens Tournament. I was going to talk about the 40-yard dash, considering it has been the NFL combine recently.

But as a Detroit bad boys Pistons fans, I can’t go past one of the biggest bad boys of them all, Bill Laimbeer, especially since I was lucky enough to meet him on one of my earlier trips to Detroit. I caught him at an airport and got his autograph. I’ll take a photo of that and put it in the show notes. So I’m going to dedicate this episode to Bill Laimbeer.

You can get all the show notes, all the links of everything that was discussed today at SportsGeekHQ.com/40. As it is, you can track down and stalk, or I should say follow and connect with all of the guests – over 50 now. Simply go to SportsGeekHQ.com/SGPguests.

And please, look at the episode catalog. Like I said, I’m very proud to get to 40 episodes. Thank you for all the support, for all of the people who have tweeted in, posted, and replied that they are listening to the podcast.

If I’m not getting that feedback, I won’t be doing the podcast, is probably one way of putting it. It really does spur me on to continue to produce this episode.

One example of that is from Richard, from Canberra, who is asking about IFTTs in one of the emails that I respond to. When you sign up for Sports Geek news, if you go to SportsGeekHQ.com/ and sign up now, I’ll actually send you a few tips around how to use IFTT.

He asked, “Is IFFT more like a curation service?” IFTT is IFTT.com; it’s If This Then That. I use it as a bit of a traffic controller and an archive for all things social.

So I’ll put a link in the show notes to my IFTT profile. It does things like automatically sending Instagram photos I like to my Drop box, or I’ve got an archive of which photos I’ve liked.

I’m also saving them in a Google spread sheet. So if I want to reference them later, I might send them off to Tumblr. If I like a YouTube clip on YouTube, it will be sent to my Tumblr, and things like that.

So it’s pretty much you set up a bunch of channels and then it allows you to either archive, or send those posts to other platforms. I use it a lot with Instagram. I use it a lot with YouTube. And just I use it a lot from an engagement point of view.

So if I’m engaged with a client and we want to keep track of all the Instagram photos that are coming up around an event, I’ll set up an IFTT rule that will save all of those “likes”. So we have a record of how many we liked and what pictures we liked, and what type of users were sharing the photos of note.

One last thing, I did promise a special promo code for our One-Day Educational. For those of you in Melbourne, I would love to see you there. If you know someone who is running a business, working in the social media, or the marketing space, and want to get a good feel for how they can use social media in their marketing mix, we’d love you to recommend and tell them about the Sports Geek One-Day Educational.

So for this week, for this episode, I’m going to put out a promo code The promo code is going to be “Oscar.” That will get you $50 off the registration price. So thank you for listening. I’m more than happy for you to pass that on; that promo code, again, is “Oscar.”

Hope to see you there, March 31, at Honey Bar. It will be pretty much four, really deep-dive sessions of all the material that I’ve been using in sharing and training sports teams. But really I’ve looked to adapt it to any kind of business. So if you’re looking to use social media for your business, or if you know someone who does need to do that, I would love it if you would share it with them.

Simply go to SportsGeekHQ.com/ODE. You can get all the information there. Find out about Josh and Steve, who are also going to be there, talking about their experience in using social, as well.

Okay. Time for the closing two cents. I’m going to dedicate this one to YouTube. YouTube is really ready to take on the sports market. A quick stat: over 6,000,000,000 hours of video are watched each month on YouTube. That is almost one hour for every person on Earth.

Announcer: Please leave a review on iTunes. Go to SportsGeekHQ.com/iTunes. Give Beers, Blokes, and Business a listen, where Sean catches up with some savvy blokes. Listen to Beers, Blokes, and Business at BeersBlokesBusiness.com.

Thanks for listening to the Sports Geek podcast.

Man: I love what you’ve done with the name, by the way. The One-Day International, the One-Day Educational. Monday, the 31st of March, 2014, at the Honey Bar. Check your local guides for more details. SportsGeekHQ.com is the place to go to find out a whole lot more about it.

SGP 038: Dan McLaren on UK Sports Digital scene and latest from #Sochi2014

Dan McLaren from UK Sports NetworkOn this week’s podcast we chat with Dan McLaren from TheUKSportsNetwork.com about the world of #digisport in the UK and Europe.  On ABC Grandstand I chat about #SochiProblems with Francis Leach and Rule 40 affecting Australia ski resorts.

Play

Like this episode? please leave a review in iTunes.

On this podcast you’ll find out about:

  • How TheUKSportsNetwork.com evolved over the years
  • How UK sports teams are now using social media compared to 2010
  • Why did Manchester United wait so long to jump on Twitter
  • Importance of testing to find out what your fans is more important than social media numbers
  • Why fans follow all teams on Twitter but not on Facebook
  • Why UK teams are focussed on the fan at home to keep them engaged
  • What is the difference between #SportsBiz, #digisport and #smsport?
  • What are #SochiProblems and what could Sochi organisers have done better with social?
  • How did Google give Sochi Olympic organisers a message?
  • What is Rule 40 and why is it affecting Australia Ski Resorts?

@SochiProblems so many LOLsResources from the episode

Google makes a stand

Social Media Post of the Week

Here is the video discussed by Dan from Juventus celebrating 10M Facebook likes.  Not a bad kick from Carlos Tevez.

Send in your nominations for best social media post of the week – Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Vine… for whatever reason fan engagement, sponsorship activation, cool content….

Closing 2 Cents

A message to IOC on Rule 40

Listening via iTunes?

Subscribe to the Sports Geek Podcast in iTunes, if you liked the episode please leave a review on iTunes and help spread the word on your networks.  Thanks in advance.

On SoundCloud?

Follow Sports Geek on Soundcloud, all episodes available.

Podcast transcription

Sean: Welcome to episode 38 of the Sports Geek Podcast. On this week’s podcast, we chat with Daniel McClaren from the UK Sports Network on all things digi-sport in the UK, and we take a look at what is happening online at the Sochi Olympics.

DJ Joel: Welcome to the Sports Geek Podcast, a podcast built for the sports digital marketer. And now, here’s your host, currently crafting Facebook ads so your friends will find out about this podcast, Sean Callanan.

Sean: Thanks DJ Joel, and I do love a good, well-targeted Facebook ad. We’re going to talk about that Facebook fraud video a little bit later in the show, a really good response from my good friend, John Loomer.

On this week’s show we have a chat to Daniel McClaren from the UKSportsNetwork.com on all things digi-sport, which is the way that they tag it. We do discuss the business of hash tags in our discussion.

And then also later on I’m going to catch up with Francis Leach on all things Sochi and Sochi problems, which is both, A, hash tag, and our Twitter account, and a little bit more on athlete activism.

But first, here’s my chat with Daniel McClaren, from the UKSportsNetwork.com. I’m very pleased to welcome to this week’s Sports Geek Podcast all the way from the UK from the UKSportsNetwork.com, Dan McClaren. Welcome to the podcast, Dan.

Dan: Great to speak to you, Sean.

Sean: Not a problem. Well, first of all, I just wanted to give a bit of background into your website and sort of how it evolves so that the people who are listening who haven’t checked it out, UKSportsNetwork.com, do you want to tell us a little bit about it?

Dan: Yeah, sure. It’s actually been going now for just over four years. We just had our first kind of anniversary last month, but originally it started, I’ve always worked in sports, so I did my degree in sports studies back in the late ’90s and I worked in sports event management for a few years. So I worked in table tennis and golf primarily, and then did a stint as a willing sponsorship at the Morgan Cricket Club. So it’s pretty much been sports, sports, sports all the way through.

And then I just started working for myself and I’d got, decided, got a little bit more into social media, got onto Twitter and then onto LinkedIn, and set up a group called UK Sports Network because no one else was really talking about anything on that platform at that time.

So, and then that was in December 2009, I think. And then the following month I thought, “What’s the next iteration from there?” So a website was kind of, the next obvious step for it. “What can I give back to people and what can I start talking about?” and it originally started off as a sports business website for six months.

My interests were getting more and more into social media and there were a lot of other people in the space talking about general sports business as well. So, literally, I didn’t look at my Google Analytics for a good three months after I made the switch and then when I did look I was quite pleasantly surprised to see that I was actually getting more traction then from before, which was superb.

So, yeah, from there, it’s been going for, since, yeah, three and a half years now of just talking social media, digital media and sports, and from there, I mean, it’s just kind of gone leaps and bounds and I’ve ended up working for some great companies, and now I’ve made the switch to it’s actually been my full-time project.

Sean: Well, it’s very similar to the Sports Geek story in that coming from an IT background and eventually just starting blogging about the space. And yeah, I remember back in those times, 2009, 2010, 2011, there wasn’t many players sort of out there putting out their opinions in that space, and you were one definitely doing that in the UK, the UK side of things.

How do you think, looking back in those early times when it was a lot of learning how to use the platforms and how to use it effectively and a few of the teams were skeptical, I mean, we’ve seen only in the last six months that Manchester United would finally, finally join Twitter.

How have you seen that evolve in the UK, where now, social, for mine, is completely integrated into digital if a team is doing it right and it’s not this little outpost where people are doing these cool, little things, it’s now going to be part of a broader strategy as part of your digital strategy? How have you seen that development over the past four years?

Dan: I remember one of the posts, one of the first posts that we did, which was by Ash Reed, who still writes and does some great things in the space as well, and he actually did a league table of who had Twitter accounts, Facebook accounts, because we didn’t look further than that at that stage, and probably about two thirds of the top division, in the premier league, had a social media presence.

And now we’re talking all 92 teams are on both of them, at least, across numerous other platforms, non-league teams, amateur teams are all in there. So it’s gone from being a little bit of a novelty where a few teams, Liverpool, probably the one that picked up and ran with it more than most at the start. And I probably wrote a lot more about those guys.

Manchester United have always been the big brand and they’ve always sat and waited, and I still think that’s going to be their ploy now. Last year they employed their kind of first social-media specific person about, yeah, not even a year ago now, and they’re starting to talk more about what they’re doing, but they’re still going to be very, very cautious in what they do, sit there and wait and see what other people are doing well, and then seeing how they can do it better and what they can learn from it.

So, I mean, I think Manchester City have probably made the biggest splash in the last kind of two or three years. Richard Ayers, when he’s first started, their viewpoint was that they’re not, they were a local brand trying to go global, so they had to do something different.

They were never going to get the initial reach and traction of a Manchester United or a Liverpool or even an Arsenal, so they had to almost start from scratch, and social media lead the way for that, and they found hitting the numbers, which it was about then, “We’ve got 100,000 people on here,” or “one million, we’ve just broken a million on Facebook,” those were the stories about them.

Sean: Yep.

Dan: And we’ve seen it move on from there, and I think, yeah, I think, my views have certainly changed, and the more I’ve got to know about it I suppose the deeper the stories and the insights have tended to go as we kind of move away from those more simplistic, kind of almost, not lean by easy headlines that-

Sean: Yeah.

Dan: I desperately try and avoid those these days.

Sean: Yeah, I mean, I think one of the, I guess, key points for the Manchester United story for mine was they came out so strong on why they weren’t on Twitter early on. They sort of said something to the words of the effect of, “We don’t see an economic benefit or return on investment,” on why they were doing it, and there was a lot of leap of faith by a lot of teams, and there still is on using social, on why. “Why are we doing it? What is the return?”

And so they sort of put up this, “We’re not going on Twitter until we know we can make money off Twitter.” So everyone was sort of waiting. Well, as soon as Manchester, they must know how to do it, and, of course, they don’t. They’re now just tweeting like everybody else and realizing that it does drive traffic, it builds brand awareness, it raises a level of attachment to the club, and there does become revenue down the track of driving more people to your activations and things like that.

But making a bold statement like that to, “We’re not sending out, we’re not using this platform until we can figure out to monetize it-”

Dan: Yep.

Sean: It’s a much better strategy to follow the Liverpool, the Arsenal, the Man City of getting out there and testing and testing and testing, and that’s one of the key things to see what your fans like and you can monetize after that, and I think that’s where now, these fully, more fully fledged digital activations, where they’re sending people back to a responsive website so it works on mobile or back to a sponsor’s website or activation, that’s where they’re starting to monetize digital, and yeah, I agree. I think we’re getting away from the celebratory, “We’ve reached these many followers,” it’s not so much about that anymore, and the focus should be on delivering to the goals around the campaigns and driving traffic to your site because-

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: The numbers are going to keep going up.

Dan: The clubs will always celebrate the big numbers. I mean, Juventus have just hit 10,000,000 on Facebook and produced a video for that with Carlos Tevez. I mean, it’s a nice, little headline for them and it gives them something to kind of celebrate internally within the club and celebrate with the fans and get the fans involved.

Sean: Yeah. I do, I mean, I agree. It’s a great content piece, and the fans do celebrate it a bit. I know working with multiple clubs I still sometimes shake my head at how much they’re looking over the fence at the other clubs and what their numbers are, and we’ve done studies both from a Facebook and a Twitter point of view. There’s no way that you can convert a Man City fan to be a Man United fan.

So really, you should be really focused on your fans, and I think that Man City example before, you were giving, they’re not going to get the Manchester United numbers, but if they engage and find and reach all the Man City fans then they’re doing their job.

So, you can’t go and compare yourselves to the bigger clubs that have the bigger reach. You want to really make sure you focus on your fans completely.

Dan: Yeah, and they came up with quite a, they placed themselves as being an innovative brand. You almost created the brand perception through social media and what they were doing through that, and really pushed it on the PR front and what they were doing heavily as well. And it’s kind of worked for them.

Sean: Yeah. And it is different for different platforms. Like what we’ve found is, and I’m sure it’s the same in the UK, most sports followers will follow all the teams because it’s such, on Twitter, because it’s such, on Twitter, because it’s a new resource. They want to know what’s happening from that opposition team, especially when they’re playing against them.

They want to be able to take every opportunity to trash talk or put down that team if they make a mistake or have a bad game, but on Facebook we’re definitely finding, and again, I think it’s just the way that Mark Zuckerberg set it up, putting a “like” button on a team, and it’s like, from an AFL point of view, the Australian rules-

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: I’m a Collingwood fan, and so it’s very hard for me to say that I “like” my cross-town rivals the Carlton Football Club, because it goes against every single thing I do. And so I think the Facebook numbers have a truer representation of your fan base.

I think we are exceptions and most of the people listening to the podcast are exceptions because we follow and like every single page to keep up to date with what everyone’s doing, but I think the every day man in the street, from a Facebook point of view, they only just like their team.

So it just sort of shows that the numbers are different for different reasons on different platforms.

Dan: No, definitely. I mean, Facebook, it’s a lot more public isn’t it, because you have the, people can see what you’ve liked.

Sean: Yeah.

Dan: And you’re almost, a lot of people, that was one of the kind of downsides of Facebook, how they were doing it, to some respect, because fans really liking it, because, “I’m a Manchester United fan,” I would like it just to show my allegiance to the club, but never visit the page and never interact with anything.

Sean: Yeah.

Dan: So there’s a lot of late fans on there that are just doing it for the badge, whereas, yeah, it’s a bit, it’s not as public on Twitter, so you’re not doing it as a declaration. You are generally following it to have news on it or to try and interact with a Q and A or something like that.

Sean: So, one of the things that I always look to do, and I’ve done it a couple of times in the US, you can analyze social and digital from afar. The access to the Internet, you can see what all the teams are doing, but I’m a really big believer in offline is a really big part of digital.

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: And I’ve sort of really been banging a drum for a couple of years now, because when you go to the game you see the fans that are your super avid fans. They’re the ones that are taking money out of their pocket and buying tickets and merchandise. They’re the ones you want to engage with as opposed to potentially the lazier fan that’s just sitting on the couch that’s retweeting your tweets but not engaging financially with the club.

So again, if we’re looking at rewards and return on investment you want the fan that’s invested financially in your team. So, I’ve had a few trips to the States and I’m really looking forward to, in April and May, coming over to the UK and Europe and hopefully seeing a few, catching up with a few teams and also catching up with yourself.

You want to tell us a little bit about some of the, about the UK sports scene and, I guess, the London scene, and what I might expect?

Dan: Yeah, definitely. I mean, part of my background was in event management, so it’s one of the obvious thing to do is to start running events, and my other excuse was I’m a rubbish networker. So, if people, if you’re running the event, you don’t have to introduce yourself. People already know who you are.

So it kind of breaks down those barriers in conversation. So it’s kind of one of my lazier excuses. But we’ve running events for a good three years over here, so we’ve had some half day, full day events, and more recently we started Digital Sport London which runs at the end of every month and this month will be number five.

So it started kind of, as I concentrated on the UK Sports Network in the middle of last year. So we have different things for different ones, different special guests. So, last month we had a panel that included, it had a couple of people both from rugby and from football. So it was a really interesting one, looking at community management.

And then we had We Are Social, which is one of the big agencies, and they’re based, they have an office over in Sydney as well.

Sean: Yep.

Dan: And they did a, from my old editors team, came over and did a quick presentation on it. So we kind of look to vary them up a little bit. A couple of previous ones, we’ve done Skype calls with a couple of people. So one of them was Shegal from AS Roma, which is really entertaining just to get, as you want to come over and see what’s happening with the different teams over here, it proved a nice way of getting to know what different people were doing elsewhere in the world, whether it be in the States or in mainland Europe. A little bit harder with Australia with the time different though.

Sean: It is, it is. But if, I’m looking forward to, hopefully we can, we’re sort of in the process of trying to organize it. Hopefully I can make UDS London event when I’m there in April. It’ll definitely help me book less meetings if I can meet everybody in the one night.

Dan: There’s a good mix of agencies in there and as we get a few people from the old club and federation coming along as well, but I think you’ll find that some things will be quite familiar but other things will be quite different.

I mean, you mentioned before about being a big fan of the kind of offline and teams interacting with their kind of most loyal fans at the stadiums and those that are paying the money to come along. I think in the UK it’s almost gone the other way a little bit, so most of the social media effort, especially, is being concentrated on chasing new fans in new territories. So, we’re almost saying that, “We’ve got the fans who come every week. We don’t need to worry about them.”

Sean: Yeah.

Dan: “They’re taken care of. Let’s go and get, let’s go and entertain,” so all the second screen, all the interaction, is based around the people who are watching on TV, rather than those coming to the stadiums.

Sean: And it definitely, that strategy fits for whatever the team that you’re talking about. So it’s very similar to what we do with the West Coast Eagles, because they have a very similar setup to a lot of the UK football teams in that they’ve got a full stadium and they’ve got a season ticket waiting list and they can’t get any more people into the stadium.

That stadium, we spoke to Matt Jepp from the Eagles on the podcast previously, and that’s an older demographic that are in their stadium. So they’re not super tech savvy. So really, we’re using social to attract and retain that next generation of fans that will fill the stadium in 10 years time.

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: So, there’s different ways you can use social, and yeah, it’s just a matter of having that focus of what you’re trying to do.

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: I just wanted to ask you, I mean, what are your plans for the UK Sports Network going forward? Have you got anything on the horizon for the next 12 months that you’re looking to achieve?

Dan: A lot. There’s probably, it’s kind of, the site has looked the same for, apart from the old tweak here and there, it hasn’t changed in four years. So it’s definitely starting to creak a little bit. But, so the plan is this year I’m in the process of putting together a new website, which is going to be something very, very different. So, what it’s going to be is more of an aggregated, rather than just our own content.

Sean: Yep. Yep.

Dan: So hopefully we’ll feature some of your content on there as well.

Sean: I would be happy to.

Dan: So it involves some of the links, so, “Click after links to read other articles and other websites.” Some of our content that we’ll write for our website integrates some tweets, integrates some videos in there. It should just be a lot more, the phrase a lot of people use on websites, sticky.

Sean: Yeah.

Dan: So yeah, having different things happening during the day, because I sit there and read, I don’t know how many articles a day, from different websites. So, it’s not that much extra for me to just upload that onto my own website, so other people, so I’m always filtering the content. So we’re looking at doing that, doing more digital sport events, taking them around. So I’m hoping to go up to Glasgow soon and then roll them out to kind of Manchester and Newcastle and different areas around the UK. I’d love to try and roll it out globally as well and try and get some meetups going around the world.

Sean: Terrific.

Dan: And then the UK Sports Network, there’s a name, in a few months, all going to plan, won’t exist.

Sean: Okay.

Dan: So we will become just Digital Sport.

Sean: Cool. It actually does lead to, I guess, one discussion, being from the UK and you probably have seen it as well, is just the different hash tags around, I guess, the sports biz, and one of them is sports business is sort of the, overarching hash tag, I guess, for the industry overall, where you can get really, varied discussion, but there seems to be a real skew for the digi-sport hash tag, which I see that as the, again, encompasses everything from a digital sports point of view, to be really skewed to Europe and the UK and Australia.

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: And not so much in the US whereas they sort of intent to use the SM Sports hash tag. I mean, again, I see the SM Sports as social media in sports, and again, a second, a niche inside digital sport, as opposed to that. And there’s no right way of why you should use a hash tag.

Dan: Okay.

Sean: But I guess I thought I’d sort of explain it to everyone on the podcast. That’s how I use it, but I’ve definitely seen, because I do watch both the UK, US and Australian markets, that there is a definite slant that digi-sport seems to be European-Australian hash tag more so than the US.

Dan: Yeah, I follow both, and I have used digi-sports more, but I have to admit recently I’ve started using SM Sports more. I mean, digi-sport, it’s definitely seeing a sort of mainland European kind of feel to it. There’s a lot of French, German, Italian content on there.

Sean: Yep.

Dan: Which tends to, so you get a very diverse range of languages on there as well. So, the content’s very diverse and language is very diverse. SM Sports is very much, yeah, kind of US-led with some UK and Australian content. So it tends to be a lot more, kind of English language ones in there, but they’re both definitely worth a follow just to kind of keep up, A, have a tweet deck open and have them both side by side and see what’s happening.

Sean: Yeah. I mean, it is, yeah, they are the three sort of, people ask me what to, who to follow from a Twitter point of view, and to a lesser extent other platforms that allow hash tags, and I pretty much give those three hash tags as, “Start there,” and you’ll definitely start seeing.

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: I mean, again, it was definitely the case in 2009, 2010, and the like. That’s how we all connected and found each other because we all started using those hash tags.

Dan: Yeah, I think one thing that people who are just kind of doing more in the industry, especially the senior guys, they’re quite surprised in how small the industry is, that everyone knows everyone. So even around the world, you know, we’ll know a lot of guys. I think Melbourne is probably the place that I know more people outside of London in terms of cities.

Sean: Yep. Yep.

Dan: Because I know over at Richmond, and a good friend of mine, Adam Infanzini, who’s moved back from the UK, back to Melbourne as well.

Sean: Yep. Yeah.

Dan: So it’s definitely one of the places, I think, if anyone came up with a job offer and I was looking at something, I think Melbourne would probably be the one place that would take me away from where I am at the moment.

Sean: Well, we do have the, we do try to claim it’s the sporting capital of the world. I think if there’s any city that could vigorously debate that, I think it would be London. So-

Dan: Yeah.

Sean: I think, sorry to all my US friends, but you just don’t have enough major events and enough major sports teams in the one city, even if you stacked up New York to both London and Melbourne and they did a terrific job with the Super Bowl recently, they just don’t have as many football teams that run out every single week as well as having grand slam tennis and Formula One and all those kind of things. So, yeah, we’ll call it a draw because you’re a guest on the show, but I’ll still say that Melbourne’s the sporting capital of the world.

Dan: I’m not going to completely deny you that one, but London is great.

Sean: Okay, Dan. Well, thank you very much for joining me on the podcast. Look forward to seeing where the UKSportsNetwork.com develops, and I look forward to catching up with you when I’m in the UK in April.

Dan: No, definitely, and thank you very much for having me, and we look forward to having you as a guest at the next Digital Sport London.

DJ Joel: Sign up for Sports Geek News at SportsGeekHQ.com/signupnow.

Sean: Thanks again to Dan McClaren from the UKSportsNetwork.com for that chat. I’m looking forward to catching up with him. We have now confirmed when DS London will happen. It’s going to be on April 22nd in London. So a couple of days after I arrive in London.

You can grab your tickets now. Just go to the link via SportsGeekHQ.com/DSLondon. I’m looking forward to catching up with a few people over in England, and learning a little bit more about the English digi-sport market and what’s happening over there.

This week on ABC Grandstand I had a chat to Francis just before the Olympics got started about all things Sochi and what was happening online. So here’s my chat with Francis Leach on ABC Grandstand.

Francis: Francis Leach with you here. Sean Callanan’s digital sports group from Sports Geek HQ, and he’s here to talk to us about sports in a digital realm once again. Hi Sean-y, how are you going?

Sean: I’m good. Thanks Frank.

Francis: The winter Olympics, and the Olympic movement’s militancy against media sharing is once again in the spotlight. We can’t play any audio from any Olympic events, and certainly ABC TV can only play snippets of it on the news, not to say tomorrow morning on Offsiders we’ll probably have to do a reenactment of some of the events with Lego or something.

But Sean, in the age of digital media, this can’t continue, and social media, where you can film things on your phone and send it around the world in the blink of an eye, these cake rules are surely going to crumble.

Sean: Well, oh, that’s definitely the case. I mean, everyone who’s there is just fans, can take photos, can take short form video now with both Instagram and Vine if they can get some coverage. I’ve got a friend over there who’s helping out with the ice skating as part of the technical team and she’s sharing photos and videos, just sort of daily updates, just for everyone and her friends.

So, there will be contact coming out. So, it does make it tough for the IOC, and it is a bit draconian, I guess, to a certain degree. They haven’t really caught up with what social media’s offering, but on the other side they also are promoting it with, like, they’ve got an athlete’s hub where you can go and see what all the athletes are sharing. So if you go to, I think its hub.Olympics.org, you can see all the tweets and Instagram posts and all those kind of things from all the athletes.

Francis: Sounds like an information exchange where it all congregates and aggregates together and you can just sort of like be in the digital Olympic Village.

Sean: Yeah, effectively, effectively. Even though a lot of the athletes had a lot of restrictions, there was a bit of furor early with the Australian athletes sort of getting their back up and saying, “Well, I don’t want to be told what I can and can’t tweet,” there was some security reasons around that.

They didn’t want the athletes to be sort of giving away their location and those kind of things for security concerns, but I think once the games start the athletes will share their emotions and those kind of things, and as we saw with London, as long as they don’t spend too much time reading their own Twitter feed and concentrate on their events, they’ll do okay.

Francis: Elsewhere on Twitter, there’s a fascinating one going on here, because Sochi 2014 will be giving you the official view of how things are going, but there’s another Twitter account, Sochi Problem, which is outpacing it in terms of interest. It probably says a lot more about what people want from the Olympic Games, which are stories of disaster and problems.

Sean: Yeah, so the hash tag, #SochiProblems was something that was definitely trending early on as journalists and attendees and fans started arriving in Sochi, and so a young enterprising Toronto journalism student started the handle, as you do now, because Twitter finds itself in the parody space a lot, SochiProblems, and has pretty much just been retweeting and tweeting some of the comical things that are happening around the village and some of the issues, and now it has over a quarter million followers because its gone viral, and it has been sharing things like people turning on a tap thinking they’re getting warm apple cider and it’s, “No, that’s just the color of the water,” and if you haven’t seen, there’s the toilets with two toilets per stall.

Francis: I want to see that for myself. I still think that’s been Photoshopped.

Sean: No, well, no, I’ve seen a few photos of that from different angles.

Francis: I want to hear the logic behind the synchronized pooing.

Sean: Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Hopefully that’s not a new Olympic sport, but it just, this is where the IOC doesn’t get to control, I guess, all the content that’s coming out.

Francis: No.

Sean: And the message. And so I’m sure the organizers had tried to get everything right, and hopefully when the actual games start, as they have, and the events start, that will be the main show, and hopefully this kind of content that’s coming out will die down, but as we sort of spoke about with the Super Bowl last week, social media presents a real opportunity and a risk from a customer service point of view, and this is, I think, where the IOC and the Sochi organizers have sort of let themselves down in that sense where there’s so much content being out there and not really being on top of it.

It’s not about stopping that content. You can’t stop people taking pictures of showers that are too short, holes in walls, windows that aren’t finished, that kind of thing, but if you have someone monitoring that and responding to that there’s a better chance that people will have a better experience.

Francis: Sean Callanan from SportsGeekHQ with us here on Grandstand Breakfast. The other element to this has been the political nature of these games. There’s no doubt that the issues, particularly around gay and lesbian rights is massive, and it’s sort of been something the IOC wants to avoid because it’s always tried to have a neutral political position, but inevitably people are finding ways online to express their discontent with Russia’s current laws.

Sean: Yeah. And so, I mean, I think that’s definitely going to be the case. There’s been a few athletes that have sort of bit their tongue for the time being, but they also know that if they do get their moment on the Olympic stage that they do have an opportunity to make a statement, and one organization’s already made a rather big statement, I think, is Google, and this is where they’re operating, I guess, the IOC’s guidelines and each day when you go to Google.com, they’ll come to you wherever you go.

They normally will change their header, and it’s called the Google Doodle, and it’s just a little artwork that they put to represent their logo, and they normally change it out for Christmas and big events and that kind of thing. And so yesterday they changed it out with an Olympic-themed header, but it was in rainbow colors. So it was a really not so subtle statement and a dig to the Olympic movement that they were supporting gay and lesbian rights and those kind of things, and they didn’t have to adhere to the IOC.

Francis: Subtle and very clear what the message was, and before we let you go, Ambush Marketing’s massive when it comes to these events.

Sean: Yeah, and I think it extends to the activism online. So a lot of the marketers around the Olympics, especially in the US, so McDonald’s and Coca-Cola, ran some campaigns on Twitter with specific hash tags and the gay and lesbian rights movement sort of wanted to make, put them back in their place, to say, “Well, hang on, you’re supporting these Olympics that are having these issues in Sochi and not really presenting-” and they’ve got, both of those campaigns had to sort of just get pulled because activists were saying, “We don’t-”

Francis: You can’t walk both sides of the street.

Sean: Exactly. Exactly. So, I guess, the opportunity there is for people to have their say, and athletes will do the same. So, from a marketing point of view, you’ve got to be careful of what type of events you’re going to support.

Francis: Where can we find you online today?

Sean: SportsGeekHQ.com or Sports Geek Podcast on iTunes.

Francis: And just, finally, what Olympic sport in the winter realm are you looking forward to most?

Sean: I’m looking forward to seeing David Morris in the aerial skiing.

Francis: Are you a skier yourself?

Sean: No, I’m not a skier, never been a skier, but his dad got in trouble for holding up the boxing kangaroo and defended it staunchly, so I’m behind him.

Francis: His old man. We’re right behind you. Good on you Sean.

DJ Joel: Like the Sports Geek Podcast? Find us on Facebook.com/SportsGeek.

Sean: So Sochi games are in full swing, an absolute stack of content coming out of the games, as expected. But one little hiccup that’s sort of happened here in Australia is around rule 40, and rule 40 is in place to protect, as part of the Olympic Charter, to protect Olympic sponsors. And so the Olympic rule 40 is, “No competitor, coach, trainer or official who participates in the Olympic games may not allow his person, name, picture or sports performance be used for advertising purposes during the Olympic games blackout period.”

Now obviously there are rules around what media outlets can use the footage and things like that around the games, but this is where the story has sort of developed, where it appears the Australian Olympic Committee has been policing rule 40 and telling Australian ski resorts to stop tweeting about the performances of the athletes, which is quite strange, because pretty much everyone on Twitter is congratulating the athletes, and unfortunately for Mount Bulla and Hotham and the like, they’re trying to thank the athletes who train and they support via their resorts, and it’s sitting there in a protected, trying to protect the sponsors, but for mine, it just seems to have gone a little bit too far, and as far as what protection Olympic sponsors need.

So, I do pity the person who has to troll through every single tweet to find out if they’re breaking rule 40, but what I did after reading Ms. Know-It-All’s blog, what I did wonder was, “Well, where does Twitter itself sit in this place? Is it quite okay for Twitter or Twitter Australia to send out a tweet congratulating Tora Bright?”

They are a commercial platform; they’re making money off people advertising and tweeting during the Olympics. It’s a very murky area from a legal point of view, and it’s just, it’s a bit too far in this day and age, and it’s a case where rule 40 hasn’t quite caught up with what social media offers from a sports point of view.

A really funny parody video from the guys at Perisher, which I have a link to the show notes, where they thank non-athletes by not naming them at the non-Olympics.

So, that leads me to the sounds of the game, and sticking to the Olympic theme, here are some sounds of the game.

Yes, that’s right. I was going to take some audio from an Instagram video from people sharing around the stadium, but that would break the IOC’s guidelines. I did have a friend send through some sound from the half pipe competition, but again, I did not want to get her in trouble. Again, cancerous enough that it is just an opportunity wasted by the IOC not letting fans share content and just loosen their lay of rights a little bit.
But that’s enough of that. For those of you who thought I’d broken the podcast like I did last week, thank you to David and Dan who notified me that I’d left a whole track on silent. So if you were listening to episode 37 and you wondered where the audio went, it is and has been fixed. So apologies there. If you re-download that episode, you can hear that interview that was missing.

So, that’s pretty much it for, on all things Olympics, and I’m not going to talk any more about the Olympics in case I do get in trouble. One of the things, for the social media post of the week, I’m going to nominate, I’m going to give it to Carlos Tevez from Dan’s nomination in our interview. Have a check out of the YouTube clip for their 10,000,000 likes on Facebook. Well worth looking at.

And on Facebook, I don’t know if you have seen, if you’ve been living under a rock you wouldn’t have seen it, but you should have seen the Facebook fraud video that was doing the rounds and pretty much saying Facebook advertising is terrible and you get poor results by using Facebook advertising.

I watched the video and did my own studies, and then I also then followed up with John Loomer, and I’ve spoken about John Loomer before. I’ll put his link to the show note. His response has been the best response I’ve seen to that Facebook fraud video. I completely agree. If you write bad ads and you target bad ads, then you will get bad fans, if that’s a proper way to put it, or a disengaged fan base.

So, yeah, I definitely suggest you listen to John. He actually did a podcast on it, sort of explaining his things. It primarily was around the targeting. There are so many more options available. As I said in the opener, the ability for me to target fans now for this podcast have changed in the last 18 months dramatically. One of the latest thing, our website, custom audiences. I have turned that on. I haven’t started running ads, but you can start now, building a list of people who have visited your site, and do it natively in Facebook, not using Ad Roll or a third party product.

So, plenty of options there from a sports point of view. I’m looking forward to both using them myself and also implementing them with clients. So if you’re interested in the Facebook ad space, it’s definitely developing and it’s very exciting what it can offer, and the targeting options give you terrific value for your money with what you’re looking for.

So, the clock wind up tells me it is time to dedicate this episode, episode 38. It is getting tougher and tougher to nominate. To keep the English theme, 38 is the number of games each team in the English Premiership plays in a season, but I’m not going to use that as the number, because the other famous 38 is Kurt Shilling, major league baseballer, who probably, his sock is almost as well known as his baseball ability, the bloody sock from the 2004 World Series where the Boston Red Socks reversed the curse and finally won the World Series.

Other news, coming up, I haven’t got the full details of it just yet; I’m going to be running a Sports Geek ODE. So you also know what an ODI is, a one-day international and a 50-50 over match in cricket. So I’m having an ODE. I’m calling it a one day educational.

So it’s going to be a one-day educational event sessions on all things social and digital. It’s going to most likely be in early April before I go to the UK. It’s going to have four sessions run by me on social media, understanding Facebook, looking, diving into that ad stuff that I was just discussing, how to build a community and conversation on Twitter, and how to use Instagram to tell your business story and engage with your audience, as well as looking at all the tools that you need to develop your business or your team online. So it’ll be a bit wider audience than just sports, but I expect some grassroots sports and some business owners to be attending.

So, I’m only going to, I’m going to keep the class pretty limited. I’m not going to make it a massive event. And additionally, so it’s not me all day, and to give me a little bit of a break, I’m going to bring in two experts for some interviews on their take on digital strategy and content marketing and the like. So, just locking all of that in now. I expect to have that out there probably next week.

So if you’re not on the Sports Geek News email list, you won’t find out about it first. That’s where I’m going to be launching it first and letting everybody know about it, and they’ll also be some early bird offers for the email newsletter list, and also for you, my podcast listeners.

So, thanks again for all the support. You’ll get all the details for that, but you can sign up for Sports Geek News at SportsGeekHQ.com/signupnow. And again, I’ve reconfigured, if you want to go into the archives I’ve had to split up the archive, I’ve now got the Sports Geek Podcast archive is at SportsGeekHQ.com/sgp.

You can get all the episodes at SportsGeekHQ.com/episodes, and you can also connect and find out who the guests are who have been on the show, and again, thank you very much, I’ll add Dan McClaren to that list that week. Go to SportsGeekHQ.com/guests.

That’s it for this week. If you’ve got any feedback or anything or sounds of the game or anything, please, send me an email, sean@sportsgeekhq.com.

Closing two cents, this one goes out to the IOC and rule 40. Life moves pretty fast. If you don’t stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it. Yes, I just quoted Ferris Bueller. They need to change the rule.

DJ Joel: Please leave a review on iTunes. Go to SportsGeekHQ.com/iTunes. Find all Sports Geek Podcasts at SportsGeekHQ.com/sgp. Want to maximize returns from your digital team? Contact Sports Geek about content and commercialization workshops. Thanks for listening to the Sports Geek Podcast.

#WarriorsLive a Google Hangout at @warriors practice

Golden State Warriors hosted a live Google Hangout from their Practice facility on a Google+ Hangout.

I was invited to represent Andrew Bogut’s hometown Melbourne Australia and give the Hangout an international flavour. After visiting the Warriors in March and touring an empty practice facility it was good to see the players in action.

Warriors promoted #WarriorsLive on Facebook, Twitter and Google+

#WarriorsLive on Facebook

#WarriorsLive on Twitter

The guests on the #WarriorsLive Hangout were:

 

 

 

 

#WarriorsLive on Vine

The #WarriorsLive event ended with Andrew Bogut initiating the rookies…

#WarriorsLive Google+ and YouTube

The event was promoted on Golden State Warriors Google+ Page and all digital channels, you can watch the replay of the Google Hangout which was available immediately after the live hangout at Warriors.com/live includes a tour of the locker room with Steph Curry.

And on Google+

Thanks @Warriors

Thanks to Kevan Akers, Kenny Lauer and Kevin Cote from the Warriors for extending me the invitation it was worth getting up at 5am for.

Do you want the @NBA to bring the Warriors to Australia?

Let them know via Twitter

ABC Grandstand – Twitter Vs Instagram, Myspace and Google+ Communities

Play

Today on ABC Grandstand, Sean spoke to Francis Leach about the issues between Twitter and Instagram, Google+’s new communities and the potential revamp of MySpace.

 Download mp3

Twitter and Instagram

There were some issues during the week of Instagram photos disappearing from Twitter timelines due to the photo-sharing app turned off all support for Twitter integration. In what’s turning into a “battle for eyeballs”, the turning off of any Twitter integration availability may stem from the fact that Instagram is soon to be owned by Twitter rival, Facebook.

It could also have to do with the development of Twitter Cards, as Sean discusses.

Google+ launches Communities

Google+ is currently trying to make up ground on Facebook and Twitter by launching Google+ communities, which is similar to Facebook’s groups mechanism.

The communities section lets users create and invite like-minded individuals into a private community where they can share and discuss their common interests, post photos, videos and have discussions.

MySpace Revamped

Once a large player in social media, the forgotten MySpace has undergone a revamp recently. Sean discusses the potential benefits of it’s redesign and it’s focus on the music industry could drive it back to the heights it once knew.

Until next week

Catch the segment live on Saturday mornings (at 7:40am) when Sean Callanan discuss sports digital with Francis Leach on ABC Grandstand. Tune into ABC Grandstand Breakfast Friday through Monday on ABC Grandstand digital radio.

Want to get these clips in podcast form? Subscribe here or Add to iTunes.

Get the Sports Geek podcasts

Want to get these clips in podcast form? Subscribe here or Add to iTunes

Podcast transcription

Francis: Grandstand Breakfast on this Saturday morning, Sean Callanan’s our friend from Sports Geek HQ to talk sport in the digital space. How are you Sean? Welcome back to the show.

Sean: I’m good thanks Francis, good to be here.

Francis: Now I use both Instagram and Twitter but I do believe that the two giants of the social media, they’re at a bit of logger heads at the moment?

Sean: Yeah they’re having a little bit of a spat, Instagram effectively shut off a little bit of access to Twitter during the week. So Twitter have been integrating what they call Twitter Cards, which automatically embeds the content in your Twitter stream. So you could be zooming along and you see an Instagram shot and click it, and you would see the Instagram shot inside both the Twitter app and on the web. But Instagram turned off that access to Twitter, so effectively now you have to click through and end up on the Instagram site. So it’s a battle for eye balls, it’s a strange decision by Instagram since Twitter is one of the main reasons for it’s large growth. A lot of the initial users were from Twitter and pretty much everyone who does Instagram does share it, but we do know now – and we’ve spoken about it – that Instagram is soon to be owned by Facebook. That deal is still in the process of going through, so Facebook and Twitter are main rivals so there is a bit of, I guess positioning. But really the only losers out of it are the actual users.

Francis: And they will just get peeved that both Instagram and Twitter to the extent that – whether it’s fair or not – that they’re not being given instant access to the material.

Sean: Yeah, and that’s all Twitter is trying to do. Twitter is trying to give access to everything, so the Twitter Card stuff works with some news articles, with media outlets, YouTube videos, those kinds of things.

Francis: Explain what that is. So say somebody posts a YouTube video on Twitter and says ‘Check this out’, you press the…?

Sean: They’re rolling out this thing called Twitter Cards so you can effectively – if you’re on your computer and you’re looking through Twitter on your stream – you can watch the video there and then.

Francis: So it doesn’t take you away to the next site?

Sean: It doesn’t take you away, which is great for the Twitter experience but there are potentially people like Instagram – and potentially YouTube might do the same – and might say ‘Actually we want our eye balls on our site, because that’s where we monetise it’. So that’s most likely where the battle lines have started to be drawn. But the cool thing about social overall, not just talking Twitter, is that persuasive nature of sharing. And if all they social networks start putting up walls around it, it will – not be the end of the world as we know it, it won’t be too drastic – but it goes against that sharing mechanism that has made social so everywhere.

Francis: And so easy to use as well and so accessible. You don’t have to jump little garden walls to get to the material and content that you want.

Sean: It’ll be interesting to see if that kind of thing… So Instagram and Twitter have had a bit of backwards and forwards. Instagram wasn’t allowed to use Twitter to find out who other people you should follow on Instagram from your Twitter followers, that was turned off a while ago. There has been a bit of backwards and forwards, but really, is there a case that potentially if they both were to work in unison – and now it is tough because they are a Facebook partner – would they both continue to grow? So watch this space.
Francis: Watch this space, indeed. Google Plus has been trying to introduce it’s own form of social media as well, and social communities online. It didn’t really take off in the way that it would have hoped.

Sean: Yes, Google Plus is there and a lot of people look at it and see it and think it’s a different version of Facebook, which is sort of one way of looking at it. I think that’s mainly the problem, a lot of people went over and said ‘We’re getting what we’re getting with Facebook’. What they are trying to do is launch different products that diversify it a little bit more. Because that’s the thing, if you’re a team on Facebook and you’re a team on Google Plus, if you’re just pumping out the same content to both platforms, then there’s no differentiation there’s only ‘Why should you be there?’ Some of the things that are different for Google Plus are the hang outs and events work quite well, and once they just launched yesterday is Communities. And this is to a certain degree countering Facebook Groups, where there is a little bit of unwritten, underground power to Facebook Groups. A lot of teenage kids will be in Facebook Groups with all their mates, and that’s where they’re having their conversations in a private manner, so their parents – who are on Facebook as well – don’t see it. So Communities sort of offers that in that you can set up interest groups and effectively have a forum slash conversation about that, rather than having it on a stream.
It will be interesting to see how… I opened it up yesterday so there’s a flurry of community invites as people set them up. I set one up for Sports Digital and invited all the people who were in my circle of Sports Digital, and it’s the most activity I’ve seen on Google Plus for six months. So I did think it was funny, I think Will Anderson described Google Plus as a ‘Witness relocation program’ because at the moment there just aren’t the people there for it…

Francis: It requires critical mass for it to work.

Sean: And that’s what all the networks are looking at. If we look at Facebook, Twitter, Google Plus, all of them need the mainstream people. So if you were a financialist the ‘mums and dads’, or the mainstream audience. But the mainstream audience needs a reason to go there, so you need these killer content producers. That’s why Twitter loves the sports market because fans love their sports and love their athletes, so you’re looking at athletes, celebrities, music artists and the like. Wherever they start gravitating towards, that’s where the people will be. At the moment that hotter space is Twitter, that’s where a lot of athletes and celebs and that are getting traction and getting benefit. But that’s where the battle between the networks is, to get those big guys.
Francis: It’s that splintering isn’t it? If there isn’t a critical mass of users where you can have a conversation that is wide ranging with a lot of people, and it starts to splinter off into a whole bunch of little groups, it defeats the purpose of it and dilutes the whole power of the platforms.

Sean: Yeah, definitely. And another one that hasn’t gone away but it’s gone through a bit of a re-brand is MySpace.

Francis: That’s like the flares of social media, isn’t it? It went out of fashion and it’s back!

Sean: It is, it’s had a bit of a revamp and it’s definitely sticking to it’s music roots.

Francis: It’s found a niche for itself, hasn’t it, as a music portal. So if you see a band like we just played Django Django – a Scottish band that I like the sound of – they’ll probably have a MySpace where you can listen to their material, their bio will be on there and you can probably even download some of their songs as well.

Sean: Yeah, I think they’re definitely starting from that base of ‘Let’s get the artists’, because the artists were always big MySpace fans and that’s where it generated from. I think the fact that Justin Timberlake, Lady Gaga, Pink, and Jay-Z – all the big names – have been drawn back into MySpace, doesn’t mean that everyone will go back. But potentially, if they’re finding that they’re getting better cut-through and better interaction with their fans on MySpace – and we’ve spoken before about Mark Cuban and the Edge Rank and people not being able to make connections with Facebook – we might see the music scene grow in that space. What I try to do at Sports Geek is say well ‘How can sports learn from music? Can sports use that space? Does it make sense, and is it a way for them to connect?’ Again, I think MySpace will be a little bit of ‘Watch this space’, see how music works for it and see if there is a demand. If there are people there then potentially there’s an opportunity for sports to jump into that space.

Francis: It’s always the trend leaders that will provide the opportunity and maybe show the way with an example on how to get the best of the space. Good on you, Sean. We can find you at Sports Geek HQ?

Sean: SportsGeekHQ.com or ‘@SportsGeek’ on Twitter or ‘@SeanCallanan’.

Sports Geek in Brisbane on Sept 18

Play

If you haven’t heard by now Sean will be in Brisbane next week for a one-day workshop.  Get your tickets now.

In case you missed Sean on Sports Today 4BC last Thursday he discussed the hot topic of Twitter Trolls.

 Download MP3

What we’ll cover

Session 1 – Social Media Success from the world of Sport

What will cover:

Facebook

  • What posts work best
  • What the new changes mean
  • How to grow your fan base though your fans
  • What to avoid on Facebook because it just doesn’t work
  • How to sell merchandise on Facebook

Twitter

  • Connecting with your fans, one tweet at a time
  • How to create tweets that get retweeted
  • How to run a Twitter competition
  • Engagement on Twitter

Instagram

  • - How to develop a fan community via photos
  • - What photos do fans want & when do they want them?

Google+

  • What is Google+?
  • What is a Hangout?
  • How can I use Google+?

YouTube

  • Understanding power of video
  • Viewers Vs Subscribers
  • Resourcing Video

Pinterest

  • How to setup Pinterest brand page
  • How to sell merchandise via Pinterest
  • Pinterest board strategy & pinning tactics

Session 2 – Digital Case Studies in Sports

In this session we’ll look at how sports teams in Australia & the world are using digital & social to connect fans & drive towards their goals for traffic, engagement & sales of tickets & merchandise.
Some of the teams will we look at include:
  • Boston Celtics
  • Manchester City
  • Portland Trailblazers
  • West Coast Eagles
  • Melbourne Storm
  • San Francisco Giants
  • Sydney Thunder
  • and more
We’ll also look at resourcing a digital & social team as it applies in sports & how it can be applied to your business or sports team or organisation.

Session 3 – Sponsorship Activation in Digital 

In the last session we will look at specifically how sponsors can activate digital campaigns using social media.

We will cover:

  • Understanding your goals OR Don’t lose your shit just because social media is new!
  • Understanding ROI of social media
  • Defining goals you can achieve
  • Attracting fans that fit your goals
  • What a Sports Social Media Fan looks like
  • How to run a Sponsor Promotion on Facebook
  • How to run a Social Media Competition
  • Understanding advertising options – Facebook & Twitter
  • Social Media Activation Case Studies
  • Data, Data, Data – in the end it’s all about Data

It will be action packed & fast paced, our goal is to ensure your brain hurts by the end of the day.

Thanks to Jason & Daniel and the team at Major League Marketing for organising & promoting the event in Brisbane.

Looking forward to seeing you there (great list of people attending so far).  Get your tickets now – use the code sportsgeekbrisbane for 10% discount.

Podcast transcription

4BC: The role or the nature of sports marketing has changed so much over such a relatively short
period of time whether it be an individual athlete or a sporting team or a whole organisation their
need to be found in different areas like Facebook and Twitter, the whole world of social media, well
how do you get noticed in the world of social media and the role that sport is playing in social media.
An expert in the file is Sean Callanan, who understand the digital landscape like no other and I’m
pleased to say that Sean is joining us on the line right now. Good day Sean.

SEAN: Good day guys how you doing?

4BC: Yeah doing very well thanks. Just explain to us if you can what – what it is that you do?

SEAN: Um so what we do is work with sports teams and leagues to better understand the – as you
said the digital landscape and understand what fans are doing on line, whether it be Facebook or
Twitter and help them to harness their passion for the team online, and then effectively do what
they all want, get more bums on seats and get them to the game.

4BC: Now you’ve worked here in Australia with some NRL, AFL, Cricket Australia as well, also
the NBA in the States and I know you travel to the US on a regular basis, talking to teams and
organisations over there, are teams relatively quick on the uptake when it comes to all of this?

SEAN: Well yeah it’s still developing and so you know what’s happening here in Australia with
you know the AFL, NRL, cricket, is pretty much on par with the guys in the US because everyone’s
learning how to best use the platforms and how best to connect with the fans, so everyone’s
learning as they go and some are doing it better than others, but it’s all just about – it’s all about fan
engagement and getting the fans involved and really developing their passion for your team.

4BC: See Mike Coleman, who’s in the studio with me now, Australia’s leading sports journalist, he
was against the whole Twitter thing and the way that it was being used, not so much the Twitter
aspect but the way it was being used by a lot of people. But now you’re on there and embracing it,
so how do we get Mike up to a seven ticket summer fan.

MIKE: All right look I’ve got no problems getting followers don’t worry about that.

4BC: Oh okay.

MIKE: It really – it’s not as expensive as people think. But Sean I think one of the things, and I don’t
know if you work in this area, but I think a lot of sports are a little bit wary of things like Twitter and
Facebook, because their athletes do it, and they haven’t been educated about what they say and
we’ve had so many examples of athletes getting themselves into trouble by saying perhaps things
they shouldn’t.

SEAN: Oh definitely and we had you know so many examples of that with the Olympics where they
really weren’t prepared, one for the onslaught of fans and the attention that they would get – that
they would get at the Olympics. You know the footballers are used to getting the attention from
the fans whether it be good and bad, week in and week out, but you know I really did feel for the
Olympic athletes, that they were really prepared for the social media onslaught at London. Like
we did some training with some of – some of the guys at the water polo and one of our key things

was you want to make sure that the fans know you’re having a great time and that they know when
you’re match is on, but when the match – when you’re getting prepared for the match you know
and we say the same thing to the guys in cricket, and AFL and NRL, is you’ve got to turn your phone
on and go about your business and get ready for the game. So a few – a few of the Olympic athletes
unfortunately got distracted by social media, and it becomes an easy target sometimes to blame
social media for the – for the performance, but really it’s just a matter of setting aside some time
and then – then focussing on the result at hand.

4BC: And then the other thing that we’ve seen recently is – is this issue of trolls. And if you make
yourself available through social media, and I mean I would have thought that sports people would
be the worst examples of that, they make themselves available anyone can get to them, and people
are so passionate about their sport that they leave themselves open to abuse don’t they?

SEAN: Oh yeah definitely and you know we’ve had athletes before you know get you know get
pillared by fans, whether it just be for missing a goal or for something, you know or for something
worse and the thing is that you know social media does give these keyboard heroes a voice, but it
doesn’t mean that they need to be responded too. So our advice to athletes when they’re getting
that kind of vitriol put to them, is just to ignore and to block, because you know they don’t listen to
the crazy guy yelling out in the stands, they don’t take to that heart, and to a certain degree that’s
exactly the same on social media. So they really don’t want to pay attention to the trolls, they don’t
want to give them oxygen because that’s what they live on, they want that attention. So it’s really
a matter of taking the power off them and ignoring them and a guy like Andrew Bogut, NBA star,
you know he’s got 100,000 odd Twitter followers, you know his policy is you know if you’re a peanut
I’m just going to block you and ignore you, and he doesn’t really worry about it. And that’s a pretty
good strategy.

4BC: Yeah and there was one of the more famous cases came in the English Premier League, Darren
Gibson, a player for Manchester United at the time, went on Twitter, opened up a Twitter account,
pretty sure it was Wayne Rooney who went on to say follow – follow this guy, a lot of people did and
started abusing him, and it was really nasty, straight away, and so he – he got out of it pretty quickly,
he just shut down his account I think almost within a couple of days of it opening.

SEAN: Yeah and – and that is one of the down sides of it, and it is a matter of managing that, yeah
all of those kind of players will get some of that, but the other thing is if they – if they provide a little
bit more for the fans they will have far more positive feedback from fans than negative. You know
what we’ve seen with a lot of our players that are you know working on Twitter and things like that
is that overall the majority of fans want to support them, and you know the trolls is a minority that
you can easily ignore.

4BC: Yeah that’s for sure. All right so Sean well people can come and see you on Tuesday the 18 th of
September, you’re going to be appearing at the Pavilion at Queensland Cricket, there at Alan Border
Field. Now if you do want to head along you can contact Dan Bedford at Major League Marketing,
daniel@majorleague.com.au – daniel@majorleague.com.au and they can follow your website as
well which is sportsgeek.com.au is that right?

SEAN: That is and yeah they can either you know I’d love to hear from people in Brisbane. They can
either send me a tweet @seancallanan or @sportsgeek and I’d love to hear whose coming along and
looking forward to catching up with people.

4BC: All right good stuff. Appreciate your time on the program tonight Sean, thank you.

SEAN: Cheers guys.

Awesome stats from London2012.com team’s @AlexBalfour2012

Be sure to check out Anna Coate’s daily wraps on #London2012

Social Media Analytics – How to measure results of your digital strategy.

Infographics sometime nail it, like this one.  Thanks Raven Blog & for the spanish original version e-Interactive.

Another one for Infographics board on Pinterest.  Thanks to Michelle O’Brien for finding this one on Pinterest.

Sports Geek Tip: Keep an eye on Pinterest to see if your content is being pinned

Follow Me on Pinterest

Internet stats & usage – Australia, UK, USA Vs China, India, World

We’ve been playing around with Google Public Data and built this simple graph which make for interesting reading.

Does this graph represent how you see the digital world?  What opportunities can you see from this graph?

Lookout world when those numbers lift in China & India!

Internet Usage as a percentage of population

Internet Users by Country

State of Social Media and Social Media Marketing in 2012

Great presentation from Esteban Contreras (first posted here)

If you want a recap of great stats on social fans & how business is shifting towards leveraging social then check out this presentation.

What do you think 2012 will hold for digital teams?

Connected Real Madrid, LeBron & KD & Google+ Brandjacking

Welcome to another huge week of #BODSW. This week, we’re bringing you some great developments from Real Madrid, LeBron James, Kevin Durant (again), and much, much more. Without further ado, here is this week’s edition of #BODSW.

Real Madrid fans to be connected

We start in Spain at Real Madrid’s Santiago Bernabéu Stadium. The La Liga super club is set for a European first, as they plan to activate a new, high density Wi-Fi system in the stadium that fans can use while watching Real strut their stuff.

NBA Stars turn YouTube stars?

Over to the United States now, with NBA superstars Kevin Durant and LeBron James utilising social media throughout the NBA lockout to stay engaged with fans and grow their personal brands. The duo have started a webcast entitled, “Striving for Greatness”, where the two work out together to improve their games for whenever the NBA gets past it’s labour dispute.

Stay tuned on LeBron James YouTube Channel for more episodes.

Twitter & journalism

Hitting social media now, with Poynter publishing a brilliant read about journalists, Twitter, and the professional dangers associated with retweeting. Definitely worth a read, even if just to pick up tips about Twitter etiquette.

Aussies web stats

If stats are your thing, check out the ABS’ latest work on internet activity in Australia, with some great numbers coming out regarding the availability of broadband internet in Australia.

Google+ & Brandjacking

We look at Google+ next, with an article about fake pages, like the ones we see on Twitter, with TPM having published a story about a fake Google+ page for Bank of America, that has been set up and is trashing one of America’s largest companies.

Best on Ground

BOG this week is the giant video wall where people can try and match the speed of the New York City marathoners for 60 yards, just to see the amazing speeds that these professional marathoners can sustain for some 26.2 miles.  Do you think you can keep up with Ryan Hall?

Video of the Week

NFL linebackers are a special, violent breed of footballer. Not many are better at what they do that the Dallas Cowboys’ DeMarcus Ware. Check out the super slo-mo video of, “The Anatomy of a Sack”, brought to you by Red Bull.

#BODSW – Best of Digital Sports World compiled with the help of @Dion_Anthony